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| | |-+  What's better? ZK22. Or. 90/22?
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Author Topic: What's better? ZK22. Or. 90/22?  (Read 16092 times)
wfcwfc
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« on: April 24, 2012, 10:05:11 AM »

Ok which one of these new drop in stocks will be better?
Based on what we know so far?

The 90/22
Pros
scope rail connected to one half of clamshell so it's not necessary to remove the sight to disassemble.
Metal bedding block
True ps90 looks
Ammo storage
Metal trigger bar

Cons
How sturdy is the scope rail?
Some magazines won't work

ZK22
Pros
I like the stretched out stock
Metal trigger bar
More magazine availibity

Cons
Need to remove sight to diss assemble
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Sgt_P
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« Reply #1 on: April 24, 2012, 10:10:45 AM »

Until they are thoroughly reviewed at the range, it's hard to say.

I also think it comes down to if you want a "clone" of the PS90 or something similar but different...
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Mr Absolute
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« Reply #2 on: April 24, 2012, 10:57:37 AM »

It also comes down to whether or not you would like to shoot the gun if your a lefty.

Also, any gun with a faux magazine is a problem for me personally, despite its functionality.

I need to see a picture with that bx-25 actually in the 90/22 too.
« Last Edit: April 24, 2012, 11:12:26 AM by Mr Absolute » Logged
HighTowerArmory
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« Reply #3 on: April 24, 2012, 12:03:56 PM »

Hello Everyone!

Great discussion and we appreciate the interest and buzz! Just to clear some things up for everyone:

The 90/22 sight rail is one block of CNC milled aluminum with a black mil-spec hardcoat anodized finish, no seems. It will be bedded into the left shell which means the gun can come apart without having to remove the optic. The rail is also (once together) transversed by 3 bolts that pass through it to anchor the rail even more firmly to both left and right halves. It's pretty darn sturdy.

Our trigger linkage is also steel for minimal flex and features a selector that allows for 5 different amounts of trigger "take-up". That is to say, each 10/22 and each 90/22 trigger rod has slightly different lengths (which may result in a gap between link and ruger trigger), so we include another part that allows that difference to be minimized, or eliminated. The end result is that when you pull the trigger, you are immediately putting pressure on the actual 10/22 trigger, instead of just pushing the rod until it contacts the real 10/22 trigger.

The storage box for spare rounds is removable and not necessary for using the rifle. We just liked to keep it accurate for those who want the look.

At the end of the day both stocks will be great products, I'm sure. We have nothing against Red Jacket and look forward to another great option for all 10/22 enthusiasts. Like it has been said, what it will boil down to is if you want a P90 style stock or something like a P90 style stock but with merits of its own. We really do appreciate all the discussion and all the input. You guys rock! Keep in touch with us. It will be done very soon!

Andy and the Team at HTA
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HighTowerArmory
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« Reply #4 on: April 24, 2012, 12:08:03 PM »

Also, we are developing a shell deflector- (in prototype phase, but will be going to tool soon, once we have some more income  Smiley). We also have a number of other really cool accessories coming out for it which will probably be offered to early buyers at a heavily discounted rate. Just keep checking the site for more info. Thanks again everyone!
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johnny9
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« Reply #5 on: April 24, 2012, 12:52:18 PM »

id bet  that with a milled hard coat sight block and reciever it will sell itself once some reviews are available Wink
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HighTowerArmory
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« Reply #6 on: April 24, 2012, 04:14:45 PM »

We hope so Johnny, we hope so! Thanks again sir, for your input here and everywhere else on the web, you are the man! We at HTA appreciate it greatly!  Cheesy
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wfcwfc
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« Reply #7 on: April 24, 2012, 05:24:56 PM »

It appears that my uninformed speculation has elicited some additional valuable information.
Maybe I should speak of what I know not more often.
But then again, to quote Abraham Lincoln
"It is better to keep quiet at the risk of appearing stupid than to open ones mouth and remove all doubt"
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HighTowerArmory
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« Reply #8 on: April 24, 2012, 06:33:15 PM »

Nonesense wfcwfc! Awesome topic and great discussion! This is the kind of conversation HTA needs to help boost awareness- we appreciate ALL input/comments/questions! Keep it coming gentlemen! Thanks
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wfcwfc
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« Reply #9 on: April 24, 2012, 10:13:55 PM »

OK this question is for you 10/22 muzzelite owners.
How important is it to be able to open up the clamshell for cleaning and or maintenance?
How often do you really disassemble your rifle?

The answer to this question will properly weight the advantage of not needing to remove the sighting device for disassembly.
« Last Edit: April 25, 2012, 06:22:02 AM by wfcwfc » Logged
Sgt_P
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« Reply #10 on: April 24, 2012, 11:34:53 PM »

I've read many times that some guys NEVER clean their 1022.

I, on the other hand, believe in cleaning the bolt and receiver occasionally.  So I pull mine apart often.

But here's the most important part.  The sights (and whatever is attached to the plastic) are never in the same place twice!  So I attached/clamped a green laser to the barrel....
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firebert
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« Reply #11 on: May 11, 2012, 07:43:23 AM »

I like them both. I actually like how RJF deviated a bit from the P90 with a longer top rail / carry handle. But the HTA dummy supressor really completes the package because the thin 22 barrel looks a bit odd sticking out of the front of the bullpup.
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WildKarrde
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« Reply #12 on: May 22, 2012, 08:41:15 PM »

I'm definitely buying either a 90/22 or ZK-22. This us what I've found regarding the two.

90/22
Price: $229.99
Availability: Probably by the end of June.
Great P90 replica.
Fixed site rail to maintain zero while dismantling weapon for cleaning.
Optional barrel shroud included, Optional barrel available after release.
Aluminum bedding block
Shell deflector available soon after release.


ZK-22
Price: $299.00, Introductory Price: $229.00
Availability: Sometime Fall
Great bullpup with P90 characteristics.
The longer site rail makes me feel like it would be better suited for a more traditional scope.
Not sure that a barrel shroud is included or even available. The pictures available and concept model use an aftermarket barrel
Bedding unknown
Comes with shell deflector

So to me, the big differences are that the ZK-22 seems to have better site flexibility. I want to use a 4x Weaver scope with my setup, and I don't want to hafta worry about not being able to achieve proper eye relief. I'm also wondering if this would even be an issue. I've never shot a bullpup, and only handled them to a limited extend, so I'm not really sure where the rail will be in relation to my eye.

I'm concerned that I have no idea what kind of bedding, if any, that the ZK-22 uses, but I also like the forward grip of the ZK-22 better than that of the P90.

From what I've seen, HTA is MUCH more seriously involved with the community and what they want. RJF has the good fortune of their own show, and they seem like they're pretty much riding on that reputation with the production of this platform. To their credit, seeing that one episode is the reason I first typed in "10/22 bullpup" to Google a couple days ago.

To me it's really a toss up... I'm leaning more towards HTA just because of the amount of posts I've seen from them on forums across the web. I've seen them answer a ton of specific questions about their platform, whereas all I'm seeing on the RJF is a part of a TV episode and a short, but convincing youtube demonstration. The longer site rail and forward grip of the RJF keeps me interested though.
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johnny9
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« Reply #13 on: May 23, 2012, 09:26:19 AM »

wont be long and your new addiction will be bullpups Grin  or you will hate them Huh? but i doubt it.
welcome to the forum with the most info available on bullpups,,happy reading! Cool
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Ackevor
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« Reply #14 on: June 11, 2012, 04:48:00 PM »

I'm definitely buying either a 90/22 or ZK-22. This us what I've found regarding the two.

90/22
Price: $229.99
Availability: Probably by the end of June.
Great P90 replica.
Fixed site rail to maintain zero while dismantling weapon for cleaning.
Optional barrel shroud included, Optional barrel available after release.
Aluminum bedding block
Shell deflector available soon after release.


ZK-22
Price: $299.00, Introductory Price: $229.00
Availability: Sometime Fall
Great bullpup with P90 characteristics.
The longer site rail makes me feel like it would be better suited for a more traditional scope.
Not sure that a barrel shroud is included or even available. The pictures available and concept model use an aftermarket barrel
Bedding unknown
Comes with shell deflector

So to me, the big differences are that the ZK-22 seems to have better site flexibility. I want to use a 4x Weaver scope with my setup, and I don't want to hafta worry about not being able to achieve proper eye relief. I'm also wondering if this would even be an issue. I've never shot a bullpup, and only handled them to a limited extend, so I'm not really sure where the rail will be in relation to my eye.

I'm concerned that I have no idea what kind of bedding, if any, that the ZK-22 uses, but I also like the forward grip of the ZK-22 better than that of the P90.

From what I've seen, HTA is MUCH more seriously involved with the community and what they want. RJF has the good fortune of their own show, and they seem like they're pretty much riding on that reputation with the production of this platform. To their credit, seeing that one episode is the reason I first typed in "10/22 bullpup" to Google a couple days ago.

To me it's really a toss up... I'm leaning more towards HTA just because of the amount of posts I've seen from them on forums across the web. I've seen them answer a ton of specific questions about their platform, whereas all I'm seeing on the RJF is a part of a TV episode and a short, but convincing youtube demonstration. The longer site rail and forward grip of the RJF keeps me interested though.

So I got a call back from Red Jacket today as I left a message concerning many questions.

First the ZK-22 is supposed to be shipped In November (This is what the shipping guy said they were told by the manufacturer)

Second and my primary concern was the bedding system: Now this is what scares me, they really were not sure hahaha. they said its all plastic except the trigger and trigger bar. So I said, "How the hell is it supposed to hold zero while you shoot if its flopping around in a plastic case?" he said to me, "Its meant to be a fun gun not an accurate gun" BWAHAHAHAH i about flipped. I really love the look and the rails, but not having a metallic bedding system I think its a no go for me. What about you guys? Granted it did appear to be accurate during the show when they shot the zomb heads.

I dont want to sink $250+ into a stock that wont perform when I need it to, Especially since its a "Zombie" gun I would hope it could kill some zombies. I have to go but If I remember more Ill edit.
« Last Edit: June 11, 2012, 04:49:40 PM by Ackevor » Logged
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« Reply #15 on: June 11, 2012, 05:01:21 PM »

Welcome!

Great question to ask them!  I too think the aluminum bedding is preferable, but it can be done with todays polymers...

As for them not knowing, I think their operation has out grown the "friendly neighborhood gunsmith shop"...
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Ackevor
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« Reply #16 on: June 11, 2012, 05:21:27 PM »

TThank you. Just found this forum yesterday.

I agree with the polymers being strong and would be ok with a polymer bedding. My problem with his response is it doesn't seem like they were thinking about bedding at all. Now the guy i talked to had nothing to do with the weapon he had to ask another guy for that.

What he could tell me was it has a rib system all the way down the barrel to keep it in place so there is no shaking around. I ordered the same barrel they used in the episode for weight and accuracy. Im just trying to decide if i want to cancel and get the 9022 or stick with it and pray it holds and hits stuff

Again thanks for the welcome,  i plan on building many more bullpup rifles so this will be another home.
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johnny9
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« Reply #17 on: June 11, 2012, 05:40:33 PM »

honest id venture to say it dont need bedded..if the stock was made in a mold,as it is,it will be made for the 10-22 and be a perfect fit im sure..they cant sell it if the action was all loose in there..they would have a cazillion refunds that would screw themselves real bad..cause they would get them back and im sure they dont want negative feed back for the public to see..not to mention the trouble of all the refunds people would want..
when a gun is bedded with say,jb weld,quik steel or other stuff they dont move inside the stock if you do a good job,as my newly bedded stock is more accurate now than before,,with putty epoxy bedding.

but im still voting for the smarter choice,and imho would be the hta bullpup stock  Cool
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Ackevor
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« Reply #18 on: June 11, 2012, 05:49:21 PM »

I like hta one, just worried about eye releif with a normal scope if i used one. The rail is pretty far up there.
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« Reply #19 on: June 11, 2012, 08:30:58 PM »

honest id venture to say it dont need bedded..if the stock was made in a mold,as it is,it will be made for the 10-22 and be a perfect fit im sure..they cant sell it if the action was all loose in there..

My concern with this is the quality of the webs holding the assembly.  Holding a barrel in place for the short run is easy enough, but over time is it going to be a problem?  And the guys who are answering the phones on a product that people are obviously excited about not knowing basic information about the stock is concerning. 

Again, my vote, and my money, go to HTA.  How's the time-table looking on that, by the way...?
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