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Author Topic: Trigger Thoughts  (Read 25013 times)
Amsdorf
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« Reply #40 on: July 12, 2013, 06:50:39 PM »

Sir, you are choosing, quite deliberately now, to miss the point.

The TAVOR trigger is not that bad. It should not in any way dissuade anyone from purchasing a TAVOR. People claiming it is "horrid" and so forth simply, obviously, do not have all that much experience with other Bullpups or mil spec trigger groups on the vast majority of military rifles, past and present.

You are of course free to deflect from this point by accusing me of being a troll or stirring the pot.

I thought the moderators just warned us about name calling? Maybe you missed the memo?
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sentinel
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« Reply #41 on: July 12, 2013, 07:52:06 PM »

 "I thought the moderators just warned us about name calling? Maybe you missed the memo?"
 
you mean name calling like this??

 " But apparently you have enough time to be kind of a tool? "

 Roll Eyes
« Last Edit: July 12, 2013, 08:47:55 PM by sentinel » Logged
Chuck S
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« Reply #42 on: July 12, 2013, 07:58:51 PM »

Comparing the Tavor trigger to other bullpup triggers just says it's better than complete crap.  Hardly praise.  I doubt anyone would seek a premium priced car that's "better than a Yugo."

Trigger comparison should be made vs other "combat" triggers.  I listed the weights of several yesterday.  The worst was a tad over 6 pounds but a smooth two stage military trigger.

Slapping the trigger -- pulling it fast -- is no solution either at other than very close range.

I like the rifle but I ain't making any excuses for the horrid trigger (yep, that word).  I'll be buying an aftermarket trigger just as soon as a good one appears.

-- Chuck
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Amsdorf
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« Reply #43 on: July 12, 2013, 10:03:33 PM »

Whatever makes you happy....

The trigger is not horrid, the shooter? Perhaps.
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Fjallhrafn
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Dracarys


« Reply #44 on: July 12, 2013, 10:41:45 PM »

I respectfully disagree.

In my opinion, the Tavor's trigger is not horrid and should not present a major challenge for any shooter to master.


Fixed.
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Amsdorf
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« Reply #45 on: July 13, 2013, 06:37:41 AM »

"complete crap"
"better than a Yugo"
"horrid"


Overstatement, and *that's* an understatement.

People should not be frightened away from the TAVOR by allegations of a terrible trigger.

It just is not so.
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pretorian
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« Reply #46 on: July 13, 2013, 06:57:32 AM »

Without touching anything in the hammer pack,the SLACK/TAKE UP(pre-travel) and STOP (over-travel) of the tavor  trigger are excessive and unnecessary.
It slows you down.
It reduces practical accuracy.
These two parameters could/should be adjusted/reduced/eliminated.  
Different/modified/aftermarket hammer packs with reduced CREEP(sear to hammer engagement) and actual pull WEIGHT are another matter.

« Last Edit: July 13, 2013, 07:48:36 AM by pretorian » Logged

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Amsdorf
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« Reply #47 on: July 13, 2013, 07:13:21 AM »

Slows you down? Start watching this video at 5:13:

<a href="http:////www.youtube.com/v/0iKLYZQCdJs?version=3&amp;amp;hl=en_US" target="_blank">http:////www.youtube.com/v/0iKLYZQCdJs?version=3&amp;amp;hl=en_US</a>




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pretorian
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« Reply #48 on: July 13, 2013, 07:28:01 AM »

 Smiley
Slows you down? Start watching this video at 5:13:

<a href="http:////www.youtube.com/v/0iKLYZQCdJs?version=3&amp;amp;hl=en_US" target="_blank">http:////www.youtube.com/v/0iKLYZQCdJs?version=3&amp;amp;hl=en_US</a>






Nice Shooting!!! Smiley But,
A trigger that has to move backwards less to drop the hammer and has to move foreword less to reset is faster to shoot and more accurate.
You might shoot with your stock trigger very fast and accurately.
With a reduced slack and stop you would shoot it even faster and more accurate.
MY2C
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Amsdorf
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« Reply #49 on: July 13, 2013, 07:36:20 AM »

If only Geissele would develop a trigger for the TAVOR!! Here is one installed in the SCAR 17....I like to go fast. Full mag dump at around 4:10

.


<a href="http:////www.youtube.com/v/1z8ovrskJOA?hl=en_US&amp;amp;version=3" target="_blank">http:////www.youtube.com/v/1z8ovrskJOA?hl=en_US&amp;amp;version=3</a>
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pretorian
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« Reply #50 on: July 13, 2013, 07:53:49 AM »

Yep! That's it! NO personal attacks or you can find a new forum to play on!

Have you tried pulling quickly on the trigger gauge instead of slowly just to see what kind of readings you get?  Could you also post the individual readings instead of the three pull average?


Hey charliegotnolove,
If you want I can measure Famas F1, Famas G2, AUGA1, L85A1,L86A1 and 9mm AUG for you.
Keep in mind all are full auto so I don't know how relevant it is for a semi auto only topic..
« Last Edit: July 13, 2013, 09:18:43 AM by pretorian » Logged

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Samson23
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« Reply #51 on: July 13, 2013, 09:12:38 AM »

So a few people have identified the linkage as a key factor in what they don't like about the trigger pull, yet all the aftermarket work I see being done is inside the trigger pack. Can anything be done about the linkage?
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Chuck S
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« Reply #52 on: July 13, 2013, 09:48:23 AM »

Thee linkage is fine.  Measure the weight with the trigger group out.  It's a couple of pounds and smooth. 

The trigger group is where the bulk of the weight is and despite the dismal standards of the Tavor apologists (salesmen?) is really horrid.  Any trigger that you have to constantly check that the safety is off ranks as horrid.

But it's new (to the US at least) and I suspect will be improved.  Maybe not by IWI.

-- Chuck

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charliegotnolove
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« Reply #53 on: July 13, 2013, 05:32:36 PM »

Yep! That's it! NO personal attacks or you can find a new forum to play on!

Have you tried pulling quickly on the trigger gauge instead of slowly just to see what kind of readings you get?  Could you also post the individual readings instead of the three pull average?


Hey charliegotnolove,
If you want I can measure Famas F1, Famas G2, AUGA1, L85A1,L86A1 and 9mm AUG for you.
Keep in mind all are full auto so I don't know how relevant it is for a semi auto only topic..


Yes, in fact I'd make that information into a jpeg/spreadsheet if you provide me raw data.
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ShootingSight
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« Reply #54 on: July 13, 2013, 05:50:34 PM »



The TAVOR'S trigger is NOT horrible, no good, rotten, horrid, terrible or otherwise. It is just fine.


If only Geissele would develop a trigger for the TAVOR!!


So which is it?
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Snapperhead363
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« Reply #55 on: July 13, 2013, 06:10:59 PM »

Okay,I got out my Lyman Trigger pull gauge.I can't give it a quick yank.It only goes to 12lbs. and it will read OVER.I did give them a faster pull though and got different results.I threw in my AR from my first ever build.It has the standard lower parts kit in it.No trick parts. Tavor 10lb 2oz. AUG A3 9lb.5 oz. FS2000 9lb. 11oz. My AR-15 5 lb 8oz.
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Amsdorf
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« Reply #56 on: July 13, 2013, 11:26:39 PM »

despite the dismal standards of the Tavor apologists (salesmen?) is really horrid.

Yawn.

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« Reply #57 on: July 13, 2013, 11:42:11 PM »

  Irrelevant terms like "combat rifle" are thrown around to justify shortcomings of their $2,000 rifle.  I get it.    A rifle that cost that much should come with a trigger of no more than 5lbs, ala Rock River Arms, IWI can even call it "match".   At least give us the damn option!  Hell, they don't even give you the damn glorified hex wrench so you can get the barrel off!

Not so patiently waiting for Geissele to make a real trigger(#3) for my Tavor.
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Amsdorf
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« Reply #58 on: July 13, 2013, 11:45:23 PM »

Somebody needs to let the IDF know just how awful the TAVOR is! The trigger is just horrid. Stupid Israelis. What do they possibly know about using their TAVOR rifles in CQB scenarios? They need to come on over to this forum to get some really expert opinions on just how stinko the TAVOR rifle really is.

 ROFLMAO
« Last Edit: July 13, 2013, 11:52:04 PM by Amsdorf » Logged

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« Reply #59 on: July 13, 2013, 11:58:04 PM »

 chin scratching
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