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Author Topic: New Review of the Tavor 7  (Read 2119 times)
MarkB
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« on: February 08, 2020, 10:30:37 AM »

From 1/29/20.  A good review with good 100 yard groups.  The biggest detraction is IWI's choice of a 1:12 twist instead of a 1:10 twist.  This is a common complaint.

https://www.shootingillustrated.com/articles/2020/1/29/review-iwi-us-tavor-7/?utm_source=newsletter&utm_medium=insider&utm_campaign=0220
« Last Edit: February 08, 2020, 08:15:57 PM by MarkB » Logged
DyeF9
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« Reply #1 on: February 08, 2020, 11:02:14 AM »



From 1/29/20.   The biggest detraction is IWI's choice of a 1:10 twist instead of a 1:10 twist.  This is a common complaint.

Huh?
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thehun
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« Reply #2 on: February 08, 2020, 02:37:59 PM »

Good review...here is the nitty gritty...if you are wanting to run match ammo in a T7...stop thinking it will run heavy loads...just go experiment with 140-155 match ammo...

Not sure why its such a big fuss...second...if you are buying a Tavor 7 for match accurate super sniper reasons...you are buying the wrong gun...

Should they have went with 1:10 sure...but everyone else including FN and HK have stuck with 1:12 for .gov/.mil...1:12 doesnt mean it is inaccurate...you just have to match your match load to it...otherwise it will eat the NATO rounds just fine.

Wish they would have shot some XM80 because that is the round the rifle is designed around...and it shots it well...at 1.5 MOA for me when I had my rifle.

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Tvfreakarms
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« Reply #3 on: February 08, 2020, 07:50:37 PM »

But why not just go with 1 10 twist. Will it add several hundred of $ to do so?
Does 1 10 twist are extremely inaccurate using NATO rds?


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MarkB
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« Reply #4 on: February 08, 2020, 08:16:56 PM »

Corrected my typo.  Changed 1:10 to 1:12.
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Zolkalf
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« Reply #5 on: February 08, 2020, 08:24:01 PM »

Consistent with all the other reports. What I'd like to see is someone make aftermarket barrels for the Tavor lineup. Once your into this 1:12 your stuck.
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boscoman
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« Reply #6 on: February 08, 2020, 08:30:06 PM »

It is a good review. My only issue is I tire of people crying about the weight. The rifle is within 1 lbs of just about every modern 7.62 battle rifle. Seems everyone has gotten spoiled by using 5.56 rifles for all these years.
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MarkB
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« Reply #7 on: February 08, 2020, 10:28:42 PM »

It is a good review. My only issue is I tire of people crying about the weight. The rifle is within 1 lbs of just about every modern 7.62 battle rifle. Seems everyone has gotten spoiled by using 5.56 rifles for all these years.

That's right.  It's a battle rifle and not a recreational rifle.  It's built to take abuse.
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thehun
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« Reply #8 on: February 09, 2020, 10:21:35 AM »

But why not just go with 1 10 twist. Will it add several hundred of $ to do so?
Does 1 10 twist are extremely inaccurate using NATO rds?


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No it has nothing to do with $$$ it has all to do with the round that would be used throughout the world...which is M80 ball....M80 ball is designed around the 1:12 twist rate...remember...in .gov contracts the ammo drives the gun...especially in battle rifles (SCAR H, FAL, Galil etc)Ö

You also have to remember IWI in Israel (who called the shots for the USA)...are military minded...1:12 is what it is...heck EVEN HK runs 1:12 in their G28 Marksman rifle and their HK417s...HK guarantees 1.5 repeatable accuracy with M80 ball on their G28 Marksman rifles...

A good 1:12 twist barrel will deliver great results with M80 ball...


Most 1:10 twist barrels DO NOT meet NATO accuracy standards with M80 ball...case in point...the MDR...it shots ball ammo like M80 ball over 2"...which won't meet the round spec required by NATO/STANAG...but a Tavor will...or a SCAR...or G28...for example...my Tavor 7 when I had it, with Federal XM80...it ran 1.5-1.55MOA...5-shot group...

Can a 1:10 twist barrel shot XM80 well...yup...my POF delivers the same accuracy as my Tavor 7 did with XM80...POF uses Mike Rock 5R barrels which are known to be one of the best, it is the same barrel that my LMT MWS used and it delivered the same results...but truthfully, when I measured...Mike Rock 5R barrels are more like 1:11.25 twist...

Again, I cannot say this more...if you want match accuracy...barrel twist alone is not a common denominator on absolute accuracy capability...accuracy comes down to a lot more than that...

Honestly, if 1.5 MOA doesn't satisfy someone out of a non-match rifle using regular ball ammo...I don't think anything will for those people and they arent being realist.

Someone will raise the flag but what about this and this round that the military are testing...blah blah blah...or what about these MkXXX rounds that blah blah blah uses...M80 ball is not going anywhere as a mainstream battle round throughout the world...ESPECIALLY to countries who are adopting former Soviet weaponry to NATO...so offering 1:12 twist battle rifles is a very good logical move and I see no problems with it...if you don't like accuracy out of the 1:12 with heavy loads...you just have to switch over to lighter rounds...
« Last Edit: February 09, 2020, 03:46:00 PM by thehun » Logged
MarkB
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« Reply #9 on: February 09, 2020, 10:35:21 AM »

For thehun.  I couldn't find the non-existent "like button" so here you go.
   
I LIKE!
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boscoman
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« Reply #10 on: February 09, 2020, 11:12:59 AM »

For thehun.  I couldn't find the non-existent "like button" so here you go.
  
I LIKE!

Agreed.

IWI really doesn't care what the US market wants. It is about military & LE contracts that bring with them hopefully better political relationships & support for the country. With that, hopefully over time as the rifle proves itself, Governments will look at it as a good platform for their military's & LE.
 
As to the accuracy, yes 1.5 MOA is just fine. Can't cope with that then I would suggest a good bolt rifle made specifically for accuracy.

Again, thehun...well said.
« Last Edit: February 09, 2020, 11:15:52 AM by boscoman » Logged

"Good people sleep peacefully in their beds at night, only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf."

Courage is not a lack of fear, but one's ability to overcome it
thehun
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« Reply #11 on: February 09, 2020, 03:49:22 PM »

IWI does care a lot about us. Iíve had some good convos with the IWI people.

With the recent manufacturing move by IWI stateside just proves how much they care.

Thanks guys for the comments I just like to keep it real as much as possible. I think sometimes things get muddied up too much.
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Tvfreakarms
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« Reply #12 on: February 09, 2020, 04:10:47 PM »

But why not just go with 1 10 twist. Will it add several hundred of $ to do so?
Does 1 10 twist are extremely inaccurate using NATO rds?


Sent from my SM-G965U1 using Tapatalk



No it has nothing to do with $$$ it has all to do with the round that would be used throughout the world...which is M80 ball....M80 ball is designed around the 1:12 twist rate...remember...in .gov contracts the ammo drives the gun...especially in battle rifles (SCAR H, FAL, Galil etc)Ö

You also have to remember IWI in Israel (who called the shots for the USA)...are military minded...1:12 is what it is...heck EVEN HK runs 1:12 in their G28 Marksman rifle and their HK417s...HK guarantees 1.5 repeatable accuracy with M80 ball on their G28 Marksman rifles...

A good 1:12 twist barrel will deliver great results with M80 ball...


Most 1:10 twist barrels DO NOT meet NATO accuracy standards with M80 ball...case in point...the MDR...it shots ball ammo like M80 ball over 2"...which won't meet the round spec required by NATO/STANAG...but a Tavor will...or a SCAR...or G28...for example...my Tavor 7 when I had it, with Federal XM80...it ran 1.5-1.55MOA...5-shot group...

Can a 1:10 twist barrel shot XM80 well...yup...my POF delivers the same accuracy as my Tavor 7 did with XM80...POF uses Mike Rock 5R barrels which are known to be one of the best, it is the same barrel that my LMT MWS used and it delivered the same results...but truthfully, when I measured...Mike Rock 5R barrels are more like 1:11.25 twist...

Again, I cannot say this more...if you want match accuracy...barrel twist alone is not a common denominator on absolute accuracy capability...accuracy comes down to a lot more than that...

Honestly, if 1.5 MOA doesn't satisfy someone out of a non-match rifle using regular ball ammo...I don't think anything will for those people and they arent being realist.

Someone will raise the flag but what about this and this round that the military are testing...blah blah blah...or what about these MkXXX rounds that blah blah blah uses...M80 ball is not going anywhere as a mainstream battle round throughout the world...ESPECIALLY to countries who are adopting former Soviet weaponry to NATO...so offering 1:12 twist battle rifles is a very good logical move and I see no problems with it...if you don't like accuracy out of the 1:12 with heavy loads...you just have to switch over to lighter rounds...
Thank you for the explaining it.

Sent from my SM-G965U1 using Tapatalk

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boscoman
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« Reply #13 on: February 09, 2020, 06:48:57 PM »

IWI does care a lot about us. Iíve had some good convos with the IWI people.

With the recent manufacturing move by IWI stateside just proves how much they care.

Thanks guys for the comments I just like to keep it real as much as possible. I think sometimes things get muddied up too much.

 Personally I think IWI Harrisburg does care about their customers. I think they have proven that.

 My point is IWI no matter how they have been divested from the Government, they still answer to them & the IDF fist & foremost. That means that the American market, no matter how much we are willing to spend on their wares,  still have to wait for what ever military/LE contracts they can obtain and fill. Israel need allies, and those contracts help make them.
« Last Edit: February 09, 2020, 06:51:22 PM by boscoman » Logged

"Good people sleep peacefully in their beds at night, only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf."

Courage is not a lack of fear, but one's ability to overcome it
thehun
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« Reply #14 on: February 09, 2020, 08:06:16 PM »

100%

IWI is very important to the Israel and wish them the best of luck ... the Tavor has been a huge success for them as well as the Galil...especially in former Soviet countries.
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mortyg
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« Reply #15 on: February 28, 2020, 04:50:08 PM »

Hi,
Just got a Tavor 7.
New to this forum but have been shooting 06, 762, 308 for forty + years, high power long and short line.
I have sold off all but one of my M1As to transition to this platform. New tricks for an old dog.
I still use a 1 in 12 for up to 800 yards. in 308 in a USMC shooting team  LRB clone, using 168 SMKs.
In a relationship, to this discussion, you are mixing 762 and 308 and for this discussion, they are very different.
The T7 will shot any 762 ammo with a NATO stamp on the head. It may or may not shoot 308 such as steel case Russian. The barrel clearly states 762 NATO.
So when you go to 150 plus grain ammo you are out of the NATO area pretty much, LC match ammo especially M118LR is not NATO but should function well. Just remember that port pressure is a big deal with ail of the gas guns. 168 SMK with 3031 should shot great in the T7. I wil be loading down to 135 BTHP.
As to accuracy in transitioning to this format, I will be using a reflex sight for the first time. I have purchased a M21 with an open X. If you are concerned with accuracy and use a reflex with a dot larger then 2moa you are fighting against a very hard headwind to get accuracy less then the dot width. The T7 is not IMHO a long-range accuracy rifle and I did not buy it for that. It is not that easy to shoot 2MOA offhand on a consistent basis.
Great to be here on this forum and look forward to your discussions.
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mig1nc
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« Reply #16 on: March 01, 2020, 01:48:43 PM »

There seems to be a lot of work going on lately on faster twist barrels.

This thread from a little while ago shares some fascinating info.

Not the least of which is the Chrono data.

https://www.m4carbine.net/archive/index.php/t-196128.html


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semper paratus
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« Reply #17 on: April 10, 2020, 04:09:33 PM »

mortyg - welcome -- just ordered my T7 today but had my SAR's for a while now
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