Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.
October 21, 2019, 05:45:08 AM
Home Home Help Calendar Login Register
News:

Please support BullpupForum.com sponsors!!
. . . Midwest Industries . . . BullpupArmory.com . . . Shooting Sight . . . BullpupUnlimited.com . . . Homeland Guns . . . . . . . . . . . . Desert Tech . . . GallowayPrecision.com . . . K & M Arms . . . . . . Geissele Automatics
+  BULLPUP FORUM
|-+  Bullpup Rifles (Auto & Semi-Auto Centerfire)
| |-+  IWI TAVOR
| | |-+  IWI Tavor SAR & X-95
| | | |-+  TAVOR X95 accuracy?
Pages: 1 2 [3] 4 5 Print
Author Topic: TAVOR X95 accuracy?  (Read 37251 times)
RabbitSlayer
Bullpup Fanatic
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 1,079


« Reply #40 on: August 17, 2017, 07:52:35 PM »

Anyone have any documentation on IWI actually re-crowning and fixing this terrible (4-5MOA) accuracy of earlier batches?  If they have truly addressed the issue that would be awesome.. a lot of people were just not willing to pay 1,800$ for a 5MOA gun regardless of how compact or handy it was. 




It's not a 5moa gun.
It is however easily a 2moa gun, and I've shot even smaller groups using good ammo.

This is the accuracy I am getting from my X95 which was one of the first batches to hit the US shores.

All groups at 100 Yards

The gun, first batch, serial range T005xxxx



Laser range finder to ensure props distance from target



Group of the day using 62gr bonded soft point handloads. 
62 bonded soft point, wolf gold brass, cci450 primer 25.5 gr CFE223 powder





Another group using the same handloads




Some groups with Wolf gold 223 brass case factory ammunition





I did shoot a few larger groups as well, but overall these were pretty representative of what I was capable of shooting today.  Had a 5-15mph  cross wind that came and went here and there which made things a little more difficult.  I found myself waiting between shots for the wind to settle.  ( the wind would actually move my gun too ) but the wind would stop here and there.

I noticed my Tavor doesnt shoot well with a few different loads like M193, and nosler 60gr ballistic tip hand loads ( groups were about 3.5-4 inches, and some even larger groups with the m193.
This is why I get pissed off when people complain about accuracy, they often don't take into consideration a huge number of factors.  With the shooter being the biggest factor, the x95 breaks a mm or two AFTER the wall.
Idk if I just got a magic Tavor, but my Tavor shoots really well when I do my part.  I was shooting water bottles and beer cans at 100 yards like it was my job.

I honestly think I could do better with better hand loads and a higher power scope.  But I'm not interested.  I've thought about doing a video of me shooting these groups, but I'm not really interested in buying an expensive camera setup to do so.   It's also a pain in the ass to bench the Tavor with the high sight over bore axis, and short overall package.  I accidently destroyed a tshirt I was using as a sand bag because of this  Grin




http://bullpupforum.com/index.php?topic=12164.0

« Last Edit: August 17, 2017, 08:37:04 PM by RabbitSlayer » Logged

''The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants.''
-Thomas Jefferson
RadScorpius
Bullpup Fanatic
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 704



« Reply #41 on: August 17, 2017, 09:16:05 PM »

How many times can this thread crawl back up?
Logged
johnwalton556
Member
**
Offline Offline

Posts: 9


« Reply #42 on: August 17, 2017, 09:38:56 PM »

How many times can this thread crawl back up?


Sorry if I've woke a dead horse and proceeded to kick it.. I know that can drive people crazy. 
I was just hoping for any additional (official) info on accuracy "fix" from current owners.
Logged
Heavy
Sr. Member
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 285



« Reply #43 on: August 17, 2017, 10:11:09 PM »

Are you experiencing accuracy issues? If so, this is a question for IWI US. I only remember one person on this board who had problems. He sold to another forum member who never claimed any issue. So i doubt youll find much help from us Tavor zealots. The recrowning ive never sern more than friend of a friend accounts. Perhaps once you ask IWI, you can tell us what their stance on it is.
Logged
Hivedr.
Member
**
Offline Offline

Posts: 213


« Reply #44 on: August 17, 2017, 11:09:38 PM »

How many times can this thread crawl back up?


Sorry if I've woke a dead horse and proceeded to kick it.. I know that can drive people crazy. 
I was just hoping for any additional (official) info on accuracy "fix" from current owners.

The official fix for owners is: Get off the bench and shoot the rifle as it was designed to be shot, on the move at ranges of 0-150 yards with a red dot sight and FMJ ammo. In this it is more than a match for any of it's contemporaries.

The non official fix: Forget how you shoot an AR and learn how to shoot a bull pup because there are
subtle differences that can make huge differences in grouping performance.

Not trying to be an A** but it is pretty well established now that the issues were more related to shooting technique than the mechanical aspect of the design and or build quality. Folks here, myself included, see 2"-2.5" groups routinely with most 55gn FMJ/HP brass cased factory loads and EVEN BETTER with hand loads when fired from the bench and using proper technique. 2"-2.5" is on par with the most conventional semi auto rifle of similar build quality and cost running the same 55gn ammo. (AXR, ACR, DI ARs, SIG 5XX, SCAR16, LWRC, HK416 and BREN 805 to name just a few)

No one has ever said the X95 or Tavor were intended for DMR / sub moa work, but for some reason folks think that they should be because of the price tag when compared to ?.  Price mean different thing to different folks. The X95 price to me is justified in its unique looks, rugged build quality and reliability that is not based on the need for lots of oil or special coatings to run in adverse conditions. To others high price mean chasing the mythical sub moa groups with surplus ammo or steel cased wolf. If this is the goal than the X95 is not for them as they will never appreciate it for it's other beauties.       
Logged
RabbitSlayer
Bullpup Fanatic
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 1,079


« Reply #45 on: August 17, 2017, 11:43:09 PM »

''Johnwalton556''
Is just a troll account  Roll Eyes
Probably just Bullpup777
Logged

''The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants.''
-Thomas Jefferson
RabbitSlayer
Bullpup Fanatic
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 1,079


« Reply #46 on: August 17, 2017, 11:52:06 PM »

How many times can this thread crawl back up?


Sorry if I've woke a dead horse and proceeded to kick it.. I know that can drive people crazy. 
I was just hoping for any additional (official) info on accuracy "fix" from current owners.


There is no accuracy problem.  The gun easily shoots 2moa for any competent shooter using decent ammo.
Quit being a fukin troll.
Logged

''The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants.''
-Thomas Jefferson
xpdchief
.
Sr. Member
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 433



« Reply #47 on: August 18, 2017, 07:53:27 AM »

Anyone have any documentation on IWI actually re-crowning and fixing this terrible (4-5MOA) accuracy of earlier batches?  If they have truly addressed the issue that would be awesome.. a lot of people were just not willing to pay 1,800$ for a 5MOA gun regardless of how compact or handy it was. 

Also interested in whether or not the chamber dimension or head-spacing were perhaps altered or maybe the dual ejection bold has some part in "solving"  the problem. 

Incase any snowflakes are butt hurt by my questions...
1. Yes I AM capable of shooting beyond the abilities of a 4-5MOA gun (I shoot 1/2 MOA with my bolt gun)
2. Yes I know it's not a DMR, but asking for 2-3MOA is hardly demanding DMR level performance
3. Yes I know it is made to excel at off hand shooting, but I'd still like it to be on paper at 250yrds
4. No I don't think its unreasonable for a weapon developed (by one of the world's most advanced militaries) over a 10 year period to be both reliable, compact, and accurate.

"a lot of people were just not willing to pay 1,800$ for a 5MOA gun regardless of how compact or handy it was." 
 
What idiot would knowingly "pay 1,800$ for a 5MOA gun" when they could "shoot 1/2 MOA" with their "bolt gun"?  Oops, sorry! 
Logged

Respectfully submitted,
Brian
johnwalton556
Member
**
Offline Offline

Posts: 9


« Reply #48 on: August 18, 2017, 08:09:10 AM »

''Johnwalton556''
Is just a troll account  Roll Eyes
Probably just Bullpup777


Sorry if you've had issues with others but I've never had an account here before.  I made this account just a few days ago because I'm considering getting a bullpup( X95 or perhaps a MDR)
Logged
johnwalton556
Member
**
Offline Offline

Posts: 9


« Reply #49 on: August 18, 2017, 08:35:59 AM »

Looking at these comments here I'm always shocked how emotional and thin skinned certain groups can be.  I'm simply not used to people who take offense so easily.  Being active duty the last 8 years, I just can't relate. 
The idea that you are so emotionally invested in an inanimate object that you perceive any questions about it as some kind of attack or threat, is pathetic. 

Hivedr and Heavy Thanks for your time. 

Everyone else, I'll exit your safe space before anyone else gets triggered. 

Logged
Bullpup777
Member
**
Offline Offline

Posts: 92


« Reply #50 on: August 18, 2017, 10:54:18 AM »

Jw556 - report the rabbitslayer to the moderator. I have been PMed by other members who have complained about his content, insults and attacks and complaints have been sent to the moderator.  I received a message from the moderator yesterday addressing these attacks and the deserved repsonce to such attacks - he implied all parties were contacted and asked to refrain from such posts including me.  Either RabbitSlayer 1. Didn't understand the moderator, 2. Doesn't care about what the moderator has to say, 3. Is the actual moderator of the site - I certainly hope not.  I say this because he has stepped up his rhetoric in light of such requests and nothing is being done about it.  

So Sgt P, read the post from JW556.  There are many here that agree.  If you want to clean up this forum sir as we cordially communicated yesterday, you know where to begin.  

JW556 ....... thank you for your eight honorable years of service sir.  You are a patriot.
« Last Edit: August 18, 2017, 11:11:00 AM by Bullpup777 » Logged
Bullpup777
Member
**
Offline Offline

Posts: 92


« Reply #51 on: August 18, 2017, 10:57:33 AM »

And ........ welcome to the site.  Lots of good info here and aside from a few, a great community.
« Last Edit: August 18, 2017, 11:09:12 AM by Bullpup777 » Logged
paulky_2000
.
Member
**
Offline Offline

Posts: 177



« Reply #52 on: August 18, 2017, 11:31:21 AM »

This all started because someone was too lazy to use the search function.

Let it go, man...
Logged
RabbitSlayer
Bullpup Fanatic
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 1,079


« Reply #53 on: August 18, 2017, 01:43:42 PM »

Jw556 - report the rabbitslayer to the moderator. I have been PMed by other members who have complained about his content, insults and attacks and complaints have been sent to the moderator.  I received a message from the moderator yesterday addressing these attacks and the deserved repsonce to such attacks - he implied all parties were contacted and asked to refrain from such posts including me.  Either RabbitSlayer 1. Didn't understand the moderator, 2. Doesn't care about what the moderator has to say, 3. Is the actual moderator of the site - I certainly hope not.  I say this because he has stepped up his rhetoric in light of such requests and nothing is being done about it.  

So Sgt P, read the post from JW556.  There are many here that agree.  If you want to clean up this forum sir as we cordially communicated yesterday, you know where to begin.  

JW556 ....... thank you for your eight honorable years of service sir.  You are a patriot.


First of all.

1.  You literally insulted the entire board last week, then edited your response to hide your tracks.  You created a personal vendetta with me when I called you out for posting false statements about the Tavor, statements you repeated here because "some well know YouTube personalities said so".  The entire board disagreed with you, yet you didn't listen to a single members personal experience.  Instead of being thankful that several members here told You their personal experience with the gun, you got mad nobody agreed with you.   You have been completely disrespectful, and posted nothing but arrogant, and ignorant remarks.

2.  No moderator on this site has ever contacted me regarding my communication with you.  If you were contacted by a mod about it, then maybe you should take a hint.

3.  You gave yourself away again.  You have more than one account here, and you use them soley to stir the pot because the internet hurt your feelings.


4.  Grow up and move on dude.  You don't even own a Tavor, yet you come here and s***post about them because of what you saw some YouTube guys say about it.  It's annoying to those of us who actually own and shoot Tavors.  If your sole purpose is to s***post against Tavor owners, then you will have much more luck on Barfcom.

5.
If you actually do intend on purchasing a Tavor, and you actually want to be a contributing member to this forum.  Then welcome to the community.  The Tavor is a seriously awesome weapon, and I'm sure if you buy one you will absolutely love it.   Just remember if you're this worried about accuracy to shoot some better ammo than just M193 or m855 because that stuff isn't very accurate ammo.
The gun has an awesome internal design, and it is very robust, and reliable.
This forum is an awesome place, and one of the most civil forums on the net.
 There are some of us however who become very short with people when we smell bulls***.  There are many here who are not fond of barfcom s***posting.
In my book, creating multiple threads and using multiple accounts to falsely claim the X95 is a 5moa gun is pure s***posting.  Almost every member here has told you personally that their gun is much more accurate than 5 Moa, yet you just keep s***posting dude.
I'm sure once you actually own the gun, and shoot it with an optic and good ammo, you will be happy to see it will easily shoot 2moa.  Don't believe everything you see on YouTube man, those YouTube gun channels get paid to have a lot of views that's how they make money.  Those same YouTube channels are often sponsored by firearm companies as well, even some of the most loved YouTube guys spout BS, and shill for sponsorships.  I don't blame them either, I would probably do the same thing if I got free guns and ammo.
Logged

''The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants.''
-Thomas Jefferson
RadScorpius
Bullpup Fanatic
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 704



« Reply #54 on: August 18, 2017, 01:55:49 PM »

This thread is a perfect example of the gun community cannibalizing itself every four years.
Logged
RabbitSlayer
Bullpup Fanatic
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 1,079


« Reply #55 on: August 18, 2017, 02:01:08 PM »

''Johnwalton556''
Is just a troll account  Roll Eyes
Probably just Bullpup777


Sorry if you've had issues with others but I've never had an account here before.  I made this account just a few days ago because I'm considering getting a bullpup( X95 or perhaps a MDR)

Just like I told Bullpup777 the other day Roll Eyes
....
If you don't own a Tavor X95, then don't post about it like you know it all.  Calling it a 5moa gun is Pure BS.  Almost every single person here who has owned one reports roughly 2moa.  You would know that if you actually read the replies.

You didn't melt any snowflakes, or get in anyone's safe space.  You were simply s***posting, and being called out for it.  I'm not the only one who called you out, I was just the most dry about it.

I have a hard time believing you aren't Bullpup777.  Same posting style, same attitude, same vocabulary, don't own an X95', etc, just like another account  Roll Eyes

But hey, if you're not here solely to troll, then welcome to the forum.  I hope you enjoy your stay.  If you end up buying an X95 you will love it, it's a great gun.  If it wasn't, I don't think so many people here would be spending so much money on Tavors, and posting here.  Most members here own more than one Tavor, so that should say something about their quality.
Logged

''The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants.''
-Thomas Jefferson
ignorantGoose
Member
**
Offline Offline

Posts: 70


« Reply #56 on: August 18, 2017, 02:41:05 PM »

Since there's activity on this accuracy thread right now, I'm posting a link to a recent review on the x95 (posted last week I believe).  In it the reviewer claims that no load they tested produced greater than 2" groups at 100 yards, and that they were able to produce at least some 1" groups with match ammo (Unknown level of consistency).  YMMV of course, but with the number of professional reviews and owner reviews I've seen claiming similar I think it's uncontroversial to claim that the x95 is capable of 2 moa with factory loads it likes and better with handloads or match ammo it likes.  

https://www.getzone.com/iwi-tavor-x95-bullpup-combat-proven-alternative-ar-ak/

EDIT

Also there was a review back in May 2017 by Small Arms Defense Journal:

"The X95 was shot for accuracy from a bench at 100 yards. We didnít shoot it for long range accuracy, but the groups shot at the 100 yard mark showed that this rifle is well up to the task even out past 300 yards. The gun was fired using a variety of ammunition with various bullet weights and type. In the accuracy test one ammunition always shot extremely well. This was the Gorilla Ammunition loaded with the 77 grain Sierra Matchking boat tail hollow point. This ammunition produced groups of under an inch at 100 yards while most of the other ammunition used produced 1.5-to-2 inch groups. This should come as no surprise as Gorilla Ammunition has proven itself time and time again as one of the premium ammunition makers in the US."

http://www.sadefensejournal.com/wp/?p=3174
« Last Edit: August 18, 2017, 02:50:33 PM by ignorantGoose » Logged
Bullpup777
Member
**
Offline Offline

Posts: 92


« Reply #57 on: August 18, 2017, 04:17:33 PM »

Thanks for the info ignorant goose - good info.

RabbitSlayer - blah blah blah blah blah blah.  Get a life. 

Have a great weekend all.

Logged
johnwalton556
Member
**
Offline Offline

Posts: 9


« Reply #58 on: August 24, 2017, 06:59:57 PM »

This might be the first time I've had to convince someone on the interwebs I'm ....me.  Roll Eyes

If the 777 guy is part of an elite helicopter unit, operating in the national capitol region then, ok.  He's me.            
           Otherwise THIS is me.  

Here's my "office," under NVG's flying past the Washington monument,

Here's me running up a UH-60 Blackhawk for duty,

And here's me kicking ass, flying multi-ship.  


First time posting pics, I have NO idea if they will show up properly.  


* nvg7.jpg (358.41 KB, 994x661 - viewed 262 times.)

* run up2.jpg (379.87 KB, 1040x625 - viewed 250 times.)

* flying.png (767.14 KB, 860x665 - viewed 264 times.)
« Last Edit: August 24, 2017, 07:51:47 PM by johnwalton556 » Logged
RabbitSlayer
Bullpup Fanatic
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 1,079


« Reply #59 on: August 24, 2017, 08:57:22 PM »

This might be the first time I've had to convince someone on the interwebs I'm ....me.  Roll Eyes

If the 777 guy is part of an elite helicopter unit, operating in the national capitol region then, ok.  He's me.            
           Otherwise THIS is me.  

Here's my "office," under NVG's flying past the Washington monument,

Here's me running up a UH-60 Blackhawk for duty,

And here's me kicking ass, flying multi-ship.  


First time posting pics, I have NO idea if they will show up properly.  

Wow dude.  That is bad ass.  Much cooler than any office I've sat in.  My buddy was a helicopter pilot in the military, and told me all kinds of awesome stories.

Sorry for giving ya a hard time, the internet is full of trolls and I didn't know if you were trolling or not.
 You'll love the X95, it is a great weapon.
Logged

''The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants.''
-Thomas Jefferson
Pages: 1 2 [3] 4 5 Print 
Jump to:  



Login with username, password and session length

Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Powered by SMF 1.1.21 | SMF © 2015, Simple Machines
SimplePortal 2.3.5 © 2008-2012, SimplePortal
Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!