BULLPUP FORUM

Bullpup Rifles (Auto & Semi-Auto Centerfire) => Desert Tech MDR => Topic started by: reason on January 05, 2018, 07:37:06 PM



Title: 2018 update
Post by: reason on January 05, 2018, 07:37:06 PM
https://www.facebook.com/deserttechHQ/videos/1750911044939630/ (https://www.facebook.com/deserttechHQ/videos/1750911044939630/)

“MDR shipping update January 5, 2018
Dear Valued Customers,

    Our November 2017 update stated that our expectation was to ship a small batch or two of MDR’s prior to February and then move to high volume production in late February 2018.
Shortly after this update went out, we received news from our MIM supplier stating that they were able to speed up the schedule of the MDR side panels, allowing a sooner than expected ramp up. This information was not announced publicly but was released to our customers on the direct pre-order list and many of our dealers.

    Most recently, a situation beyond the control of Desert Tech and our MIM supplier arose that postponed the time line of the December batch.The issue lies with the foreign government where our MIM supplier is located.  It has recently instated more stringent export regulations on firearms parts. The added scrutiny put a freeze on firearm parts being exported from the country, requiring our MIM supplier to jump through additional, unforeseen hoops of bureaucratic regulation to export firearm parts to the US. These new regulations were not unique to Desert Tech and affected many U.S. Firearms manufacturers.

     Over the past few weeks, Desert Tech teamed up with our MIM supplier and several large U.S. firearms manufacturers to present a case to the foreign government, requesting relief from these added regulations. Thankfully, with the help of all involved, their government ruled in our favor, has released the parts and noted additional considerations will be made in future regulations.
These parts were scheduled to arrive in December. We now expect they will arrive by the end of next week (January 12th). 
         While we await the arrival of these parts, MDRs are being assembled and are only waiting on these parts for final testing. Once the parts arrive, they will be finished, installed and tested in the assembled MDR’s, then packed & shipped.

       We are hopeful that our next shipments will begin in late January and that we will transition to high volume by the end of February.
Our internal goal is to have all MDR .308 Rifle preorders filled before the end of April 2018.

On another note.

          I’m Super excited to inform you that our testing of the .223 MDR is on track and we remain hopeful to meet our current timeline. We will have fully functioning .223 MDR’s at Shot Show Range Day; along with a couple of surprises in our booth that will add even more excitement to the MDR. 

         If you are going to Shot Show, stop by our booth (#31502). If not, stay up to date via Facebook, Twitter & Instagram and talk to your local Desert Tech Dealer for the latest MDR info.

Sincerely,
Carson Jenkins
Director of Marketing
Desert Tech LLC”


Title: Re: 2018 update
Post by: Slateman on January 05, 2018, 07:41:49 PM
They outsourced MIM to a foreign country?!?


Title: Re: 2018 update
Post by: Frostburg on January 05, 2018, 08:18:28 PM
While I'm kind of indifferent to the matter of where they get their parts from, this is a bit of a far cry from the original idea that they produce all parts in-house, which would have negated any of these issues coming up in the past many months. When you want a job done right, you gotta do it yourself.


Title: Re: 2018 update
Post by: sampitt on January 05, 2018, 08:35:05 PM
They outsourced MIM to a foreign country?!?

"Hey Pakistan, this is your old buddy Mullah Nick.  sorry about cancelling your hti order but I was wondering if your shoe cobblers could get me these ejection panels busted out for me before s***show 2018.  Mmmmkay thanks and salam alaykom to you to."


Title: Re: 2018 update
Post by: sampitt on January 05, 2018, 08:40:32 PM
I want mine cnc'd and made here....I'll wait


Title: Re: 2018 update
Post by: EWTHeckman on January 05, 2018, 08:41:09 PM
Thanks for passing this along, reason!


Title: Re: 2018 update
Post by: Slateman on January 05, 2018, 08:42:35 PM
I want mine cnc'd and made here....I'll wait
I'm betting that isn't an option


Title: Re: 2018 update
Post by: kfeltenberger on January 05, 2018, 08:46:16 PM
What the f&*k, DT?!  

I'm not even going to try and come up with an explanation for this...here's your shovel...dig your hole as deep as you want.


Title: Re: 2018 update
Post by: Sdevante on January 05, 2018, 08:57:05 PM
Surprise surprise, more bulls***. Meanwhile, IWI will be shipping the Tavor 7 soon. Made in a foreign country, but a better one than DT is likely using LOL.


Title: Re: 2018 update
Post by: Clarke-Sensei on January 05, 2018, 09:02:13 PM
Are they kidding? I can understand outsourcing, but this is ridiculous on their part.


Title: Re: 2018 update
Post by: reason on January 05, 2018, 09:04:54 PM
One positive... look at all those receivers-parts...


Title: Re: 2018 update
Post by: Frostburg on January 05, 2018, 09:10:05 PM
While there are announced delays regarding the ejection panels being foreign made due to its recent delays, how much of the remainder of the rifle is also foreign made? I'm curious to know what percentage of the rifle is American made vs. made in foreign countries.


Title: Re: 2018 update
Post by: sampitt on January 05, 2018, 09:26:25 PM
While there are announced delays regarding the ejection panels being foreign made due to its recent delays, how much of the remainder of the rifle is also foreign made? I'm curious to know what percentage of the rifle is American made vs. made in foreign countries.
Yeah noooooo s***!


Title: Re: 2018 update
Post by: Potss on January 05, 2018, 11:48:08 PM
kfeltenberger we are finally on the same page.  FFS I wish they'd sell the design to someone competent enough not to f*** up such a rifle with so much potential.  Maybe Ruger the king of MIM (no really they do a great job), or someone with enough capital to throw around like S&W.  We all rag on Freedom Group and Bushmaster for f***ing things up so royally but honestly how much worse would they be than DTA is now?  Not that I hope the MDR ever end up in either of their clutches, but seriously this is insane it is 2018 already!


Title: Re: 2018 update
Post by: kfeltenberger on January 06, 2018, 12:05:52 AM
kfeltenberger we are finally on the same page.  FFS I wish they'd sell the design to someone competent enough not to f*** up such a rifle with so much potential.  Maybe Ruger the king of MIM (no really they do a great job), or someone with enough capital to throw around like S&W.  We all rag on Freedom Group and Bushmaster for f***ing things up so royally but honestly how much worse would they be than DTA is now?  Not that I hope the MDR ever end up in either of their clutches, but seriously this is insane it is 2018 already!

I agree.  Right now, I can't imagine why DT didn't utilize a domestic MIM partner, especially when Ruger's Arizona operation was so close. 

Is designing an bringing an all new design, especially one as complex as the MDR, to market easy?  No.  Not as an aggregate whole.  However, based on my own experience and those of people I know who have "been there and done that" when it comes to manufacturing, I am really beginning to wonder if DT has a competent *mass production* production consultant.  I was willing to accept glitches in August and then into early October.  But these issues...if it is truly a subcontractor/export issue, then I'd like to see some actual industry chatter about it.  Who are the other companies that were impacted? 

I'm a loyal dog, I think I've proven that over the past few years.  But right now, if anyone from DT is reading this, this dog is wondering if it isn't time to walk away.  The MDR is *the* rifle that will fit all of my needs, but in addition to the hardware (which with the consistent charging handle issues), I also have to have confidence in the company.  That confidence is wearing thin.

Finally, since I'm venting a bit on a cold Friday night...we were told we'd be "taken care of".  What and when? 


Title: Re: 2018 update
Post by: JesseJames38 on January 06, 2018, 12:29:45 AM
Well my hopes are quickly dwindling in the MDR,  Still have the pre order in with Euro optics.  But the  Tavor 7 is starting to look more and more appealing right now.  The excuses are all the same every time.  Its always "out of our control" and "issues with our MIM parts supplier"

I am thinking my biggest disappointment now is that these MIM suppliers are a out of the country supplier. And the biggest thing I was looking forward to was the rifle "Made in America" and in house.        They may as well take that sticker off there page and just replace it with a generic "Assembled in America"    If it even that.

At this point in time I am really considering picking up the Tavor 7.  The deciding factor for me right now is which one comes out first. And things are looking pretty Grim for the MDR. The more Desert Tech messes up they may as well kiss my money good bye.

Jesse.



Title: Re: 2018 update
Post by: reason on January 06, 2018, 01:05:44 AM
Quote
FFS I wish they'd sell the design to someone competent enough not to f*** up such a rifle with so much potential.

Yeah, I wish another company would come from nowhere with a better multical bullpup. I have very little respect for DT as a company after this whole ordeal.


Title: Re: 2018 update
Post by: Ditcher on January 06, 2018, 02:25:18 AM
I was wondering why it took them so long to ship out the few rifles they have after they said the parts were on the way.  Because they had to cross the ocean. lol
I'm also considering moving on. Hard call after waiting so loooong.


Title: Re: 2018 update
Post by: Dogslayer on January 06, 2018, 02:44:23 AM
There is only so many excuses in the whole world, Desert Tech has used 10 times their share.
People who still believe in DT are delusional, with all the CNC mills they allegedly have
they could have made hundreds of those things by now. Stay tuned for the next DT BS story...
"There is a sucker born every minute", PT Barnum....


Title: Re: 2018 update
Post by: patrick711 on January 06, 2018, 05:53:26 AM
One probability could be, because DT didnt pay in a timely fashion, its in country parts suppliers refused to get screwed over again. Had to go outside of USA.


Title: Re: 2018 update
Post by: INV136 on January 06, 2018, 01:51:23 PM
"Shortly after this update went out, we received news from our MIM supplier stating that they were able to speed up the schedule of the MDR side panels, allowing a sooner than expected ramp up. This information was not announced publicly but was released to our customers on the direct pre-order list and many of our dealers."

Hmmmmmmm. I placed my pre-paid order through their website and I never received any notification about this.  ???


Title: Re: 2018 update
Post by: bpguy on January 06, 2018, 06:09:59 PM
Why are you guys so surprised that they outsourced parts overseas.  I told you back in October that they were doing this but no one believed me I guess.  And this is not the only part that is outsourced overseas either.

http://bullpupforum.com/index.php?topic=12382.msg132174#msg132174 (http://bullpupforum.com/index.php?topic=12382.msg132174#msg132174)

"If they can get their parts from Malaysia in a timely fashion and their prints are fully defined with tolerances that allow for stack up then there is no need for the QC department to "Learn" what is acceptable.  The part is either good or its not.  If it is not to print then it is rejected.  Simple as that.  Outsourcing can be a nightmare say the least and has to do with a lot of DT problems.  When you can not control your own destiny you have to rely on others and when they fall down you do to.  That is why it is key to having good suppliers.  It is the continual lies that DT tells that gets to me.  The truth shall set you free."


Title: Re: 2018 update
Post by: rtp on January 06, 2018, 07:33:12 PM
Eh?  Box certainly claims otherwise, although I suppose mine has non-Malaysian ejection covers.  (Doesn't stop it from needing to go back, sadly  >:( )
(https://i.imgur.com/2eLUGXW.jpg)


Title: Re: 2018 update
Post by: rtp on January 06, 2018, 07:36:02 PM
The update is 'ok,' put in context of all the prior ones.

This is the largest number of MDR 'pieces' we've seen to date.  So regardless of how many pieces are missing from the videos, it's a lot more than has been seen to date, so - we'll see.

Here's hoping once mine eventually goes back for the charging handle failure to lock back, they've also sorted the mag release and no one else sees charging handle issues.


Title: Re: 2018 update
Post by: Dogslayer on January 06, 2018, 07:53:01 PM
If they show you a picture of 1,000 barrels and 2 ejection panels they can assemble 1 rifle.

Dogslayer


Title: Re: 2018 update
Post by: Frostburg on January 06, 2018, 08:02:55 PM
Why are you guys so surprised that they outsourced parts overseas.  I told you back in October that they were doing this but no one believed me I guess.  And this is not the only part that is outsourced overseas either.

http://bullpupforum.com/index.php?topic=12382.msg132174#msg132174 (http://bullpupforum.com/index.php?topic=12382.msg132174#msg132174)

"If they can get their parts from Malaysia in a timely fashion and their prints are fully defined with tolerances that allow for stack up then there is no need for the QC department to "Learn" what is acceptable.  The part is either good or its not.  If it is not to print then it is rejected.  Simple as that.  Outsourcing can be a nightmare say the least and has to do with a lot of DT problems.  When you can not control your own destiny you have to rely on others and when they fall down you do to.  That is why it is key to having good suppliers.  It is the continual lies that DT tells that gets to me.  The truth shall set you free."

How did you come to know this information before anyone else here??


Title: Re: 2018 update
Post by: HBeretta on January 07, 2018, 01:27:09 AM
if they were going to outsource abroad then they should've just went straight to Slovenia and had Arex handle it all.


Title: Re: 2018 update
Post by: bpguy on January 07, 2018, 10:24:30 AM

[/quote]

How did you come to know this information before anyone else here??
[/quote]
I have been around a long time and know many people in high places.  I knew this information way before the October post but just never said anything on this forum.  But since DT continued to tell lies about all the real problems and issues they are having, I shared one of the ones that I wanted to let out of the bag.  If they do not start to come clean with all of you, there may be more.  As you know I continue to call them out to see if they will share the "TRUTH"


Title: Re: 2018 update
Post by: thehun on January 07, 2018, 10:37:59 AM
so much for made in the USA....DT...you are sinking with this platform...outsourcing parts now to a foreign country....I'd rather have IWI knowing it has US and Isreali parts not some Asian cheap manufactured crap...makes you wonder...what else is being outsourced on the gun...


Title: Re: 2018 update
Post by: Ditcher on January 07, 2018, 11:12:13 AM


How did you come to know this information before anyone else here??
[/quote]
I have been around a long time and know many people in high places.  I knew this information way before the October post but just never said anything on this forum.  But since DT continued to tell lies about all the real problems and issues they are having, I shared one of the ones that I wanted to let out of the bag.  If they do not start to come clean with all of you, there may be more.  As you know I continue to call them out to see if they will share the "TRUTH"
[/quote]

They gone this long with out tell us so I don't think anything is going to change so you might as well tell us.


Title: Re: 2018 update
Post by: reason on January 07, 2018, 03:21:18 PM
FYI :


Title: Re: 2018 update
Post by: thehun on January 07, 2018, 04:26:55 PM
Looks like DT can't handle the truth...what they are doing is nothing more than PR control


Title: Re: 2018 update
Post by: JesseJames38 on January 07, 2018, 04:59:38 PM
I seen this posted last night before going to sleep.  I also remember seeing one of the post above it that was deleted. From what I remember seeing of the previous post was the person accusing of desert tech of getting the parts made in Malaysia.  I am unsure if that is true.      And then him ranting about how its no longer made in the USA. which part I agree with. And stating that they are charging for Made in America Prices, but not being made in the states.

Over all I still think its poor sport on DT side of things.  They made there bed.  slept in it. and now casting blame on others.  So many opportunities missed by this company. All to often they always say something ahead of time in which they don't know. Or over estimate there achievements.

This is just my option but to me it makes sense why the rifles are not shipping.      I personally believe they did get news that they would be receiving there MIM parts soon. And they looked at it as, (Hey lets stop milling these parts as they are on there way.) which stopped progress of the rifles in hopes of receiving them soon to.  Uh oh,     we cant get the parts.   and we cant ship out any rifles for a month or two.   which would lead us to this point of the update.

I am interesting to see what they have to say at this year Shot show.     I am sure they will be having many dealers coming up to them asking what the hell is going on.   It seems that for the past year and a half the same issues that always comes up.  Having issues with our MIM suppliers.   and at the same time. State they use the same MIM suppliers as other big name company's.


These are just a few of my thoughts. Right or wrong this is how I see them, but always open to other thoughts

Jesse.


Title: Re: 2018 update
Post by: thehun on January 07, 2018, 06:19:16 PM
Honestly...I do not see the reason to go outside the US for MIM...especially not after how they marketed DT as being US made.

I think the biggest question...what other parts are not US made...at this point...if they have a way of doing it in house...just do in house....DT and the MDR project has been doomed by these "vendors" time after time after time after time after time again...


Title: Re: 2018 update
Post by: semper paratus on January 07, 2018, 07:15:16 PM
been out on this for a long time - waiting on the 7 - but with all the orders and probably limited places they could turn to in order to get the quantity of parts they would need, it is only expected that some parts be made overseas ---- question I guess is what?  The plastic chassis or the bolt assembly ( the big issue - don't want soft steel going into making of the bolt or having brittle extractors).

good luck to you all 


Title: Re: 2018 update
Post by: Dogslayer on January 07, 2018, 07:44:35 PM
That ejection port cover looks like a 5 or 10 minute part at most. They should be able to make
125 of them per day, running them on only one machine, assuming that they have a night shift.
They have multiple CNC mills. Using this as an excuse not to ship rifles is disingenuous at best,
I'm guessing that there are some other problems with the rifles that they are not acknowledging.
Just my opinion...

Dogslayer


Title: Re: 2018 update
Post by: dmitry on January 07, 2018, 08:14:53 PM
Honestly...I do not see the reason to go outside the US for MIM...especially not after how they marketed DT as being US made.

I think the biggest question...what other parts are not US made...at this point...if they have a way of doing it in house...just do in house....DT and the MDR project has been doomed by these "vendors" time after time after time after time after time again...
I don't want to defend Desert Tech here (who have a history of lying and I usually criticize them here).

But is there anything wrong with Desert Tech using Malaysian parts?

Malaysia has its own car industry, so I'm sure the Malaysians know how to make MIM parts.

-

As the for 'Made in the USA' label - all that actually has to mean is that it is assembled in the US. Many companies outsource part of their production to Asia.  Even Apple outsources a lot of its parts manufacturing to China (and I don't have any problem with my iPhone). 

Countries like Malaysia have much lower labor costs compared to the US, so it saves a lot of money to outsource production there, as the workforce and salaries are far cheaper to pay in Malaysia (and the quality can often be very good).


Title: Re: 2018 update
Post by: thehun on January 07, 2018, 09:24:10 PM
Actually, you cannot state it is made in the USA without disclosing * with parts made in XYZ country....it is misleading...like what DT has done with the MDR.

Apple does not state they are made here...rather...it is designed in the USA and assembled in China...there are laws pertaining to goods sold in the USA...one must identify the country of origin.

If DT is outsourcing one MIM part...you CAN BET MONEY they have outsourced many other things to foreign manufacturing on this rifle...I really wonder what else.

I 100% agree that other countries can and do make parts better than some companies in the USA...but again this is just another black eye for DT's PR nightmare with this platform.

I really really really want DT to succeed...but they are making it harder and harder for people to believe anything they say or will do.


Title: Re: 2018 update
Post by: Ditcher on January 07, 2018, 10:49:56 PM
Think I have only seen one company have listed on thier product "made in China Assembled in the US" but I don't remember who that was now.


Title: Re: 2018 update
Post by: Sawdustshot on January 08, 2018, 03:24:08 AM
922r comes to mind with this revelation. You'd think that they're smarter than that even after everything, but can we really be sure?


Title: Re: 2018 update
Post by: E7G USMC on January 08, 2018, 07:04:00 AM
The MDR?  or a TAVOR 7! ORIGIN 12!

Years of waiting for the MDR? Issue after Issue! I am only going to wait till 2-25-18  for DT to start providing Quality rifles or the game is over and I am going to cash out.  I will go with the TAVOR 7 or the ORIGIN 12.  MyIWI SAR is a very excellent rifle. The TAVOR and FOSTECH are very reliable and are not Ghost Guns. :Iwo :Iwo Not any More >:(


Title: Re: 2018 update
Post by: thehun on January 08, 2018, 08:37:32 AM
922r comes to mind with this revelation. You'd think that they're smarter than that even after everything, but can we really be sure?

This is actually a very good point. I'd figure they have the right count in the rifle...but with this latest revelation...who knows.


Title: Re: 2018 update
Post by: EWTHeckman on January 08, 2018, 08:40:43 AM
922r comes to mind with this revelation.

I usually see this in reference to importing complete rifles needing to have a certain number of U.S. made parts. Does it actually cover importing just parts, too?


Title: Re: 2018 update
Post by: thehun on January 08, 2018, 12:10:43 PM
922r comes to mind with this revelation.

I usually see this in reference to importing complete rifles needing to have a certain number of U.S. made parts. Does it actually cover importing just parts, too?

Yes, in regards to parts that are controlled by 922r. That is why it is somewhat important to know what else is foreign made on the rifle.

For example: raw materials can be foreign...but making the part must be done here to be labeled American made. Barrel blanks can come from China, but the rifling, machining and finishing has to be done here to bear Made in USA. This logic applies to all parts.

You ever wonder how most ARs components are cheap...foreign raw materials and more than likely foreign made parts from Asia. Not that is necessarily a bad thing as most of those countries have more advanced manufacturing than many US companies...but the quality varies greatly based on targeted price points.


Title: Re: 2018 update
Post by: Tubal on January 08, 2018, 12:53:33 PM
You guys are all freaking out about nothing (again).

Nick's update last Novemberish said that they had MIM issues with their original ejection panel and their supplier needed to re-tool and weren't expecting the parts to be ready until Feb-March this year.

Then Stephen came out with an update a month or so ago and said "Good news guys, looks like our MIM supplier is able to get these parts out much faster than we originally thought.  We may have them by the end of December."

Then this latest update comes out "Bad news guys, MIM parts have been stuck in customs for a couple weeks but they should be here in 6 more days"

Bullpupform:  "OMG REEEEEE THEY MUST BE IMPORTING THE WHOLE GUN AND THEY ARE ILLEGALLY SAYING THAT THIS GUN IS MADE IN USA WHEN IT'S ALL MALAYSIAN OMG!!!!"



Title: Re: 2018 update
Post by: thehun on January 08, 2018, 01:05:04 PM
Negative. That is not what is being said. That is what you might be perceiving.

Customers have every right to ask whatever questions or concerns they have.

Knowing what parts are or are not imported is actually a valid concern.


Title: Re: 2018 update
Post by: whiskey91lima on January 08, 2018, 02:05:53 PM
Then Stephen came out with an update a month or so ago and said "Good news guys, looks like our MIM supplier is able to get these parts out much faster than we originally thought.  We may have them by the end of December."

"We may have them by the end of December."

That word is why I'm not overreacting about this. Yes, the endless delays are frustrating but it is apparent that they are making progress and the communication from Stephen Kingston has been professional and open. He has personally answered some of my questions and gave me reassuring and professional answers.

We are just tainted by the bad PR decisions of DT regarding the MDR in the past, the frustrating delays, and the unprofessional behavior of Nick Young on the forums. If they have another delay regarding the dust covers, MIM, or QC, then we have more right to be frustrated.

Regarding "Made in the USA", my personal opinion: The MDR is engineered, designed, tested, and assembled by Americans in the USA and a significant number of parts are manufactured by Desert Tech themselves. If Desert Tech uses top industry vendors to manufacture, particularly difficult and expensive parts, I am happy with that as a customer. I would rather have a barrel made by a top rated manufacture, American or otherwise, than for Desert Tech, a very small company, manufacture every single part themselves.

The whole idea of "Made in the USA" is that the it is top quality and that the money goes to American entrepreneurs. Everything that we have heard about the design of the gun is top quality, and Desert Tech is certainly a small American company, owned and operated by Americans.

If you don't like the latest delay, cancel your pre-order. The rest of us will have our next gen rifle in our hands soon enough.


Title: Re: 2018 update
Post by: thehun on January 08, 2018, 02:56:21 PM
One really good thing that came out of the MDR is the lesson of how NOT to do a product release. Probably doing the industry a huge favor.

I might have to make it a case study example.



Title: Re: 2018 update
Post by: Tubal on January 08, 2018, 03:02:01 PM
Negative. That is not what is being said. That is what you might be perceiving.

Customers have every right to ask whatever questions or concerns they have.

Knowing what parts are or are not imported is actually a valid concern.

Do you know which parts are or are not imported on your Keltec?  Have you ever posted in a forum about it or any other gun besides the MDR?  Sure it's a valid concern, but I suspect it's "more valid" with the MDR since it's a gun you have been crapping on here for the last 6 months.

Have any of your other gun manufacturers posted "machine monday" videos on facebook showing them machining the bulk of the gun parts in house?


Title: Re: 2018 update
Post by: Clarke-Sensei on January 08, 2018, 03:14:43 PM
I really don't see the concern about imported components as long as they are good parts. Getting cheap parts for being cheap's sake is certainly a concern on various platforms,but I'm sure DT has chosen a good company to manufacture those components that they've decided to not manufacture themselves.

In the MDR's case, 922r compliance is already a fair guarantee, bringing it up is simple paranoia.

Tubal, I will have to say that nobody expects top shelf from a Kel-Tec firearm, and the difference in expectation between a 2500$ MDR and a 1000$ RDB is monumental.


Title: Re: 2018 update
Post by: Tubal on January 08, 2018, 03:17:32 PM
Tubal, I will have to say that nobody expects top shelf from a Kel-Tec firearm, and the difference in expectation between a 2500$ MDR and a 1000$ RDB is monumental.

I realize.  I was just trying to make a point about this "concern" that thehun has all of a sudden about imported parts.  I brought up Keltec because I know thehun is an owner and a fan (which there is nothing wrong with).


Title: Re: 2018 update
Post by: Potss on January 08, 2018, 03:22:50 PM
I'm not sure what on earth makes you think DTA is capable of choosing good suppliers foreign or domestic.  They have proven nothing but the opposite for years now.  No real point in speculating because we will never know (they could have made it all up again), but to claim that "you are sure DTA chose good parts" is a bad joke at this point.

Do you know what the biggest difference is between a $800 RDB and a $2500 MDR?  I can actually buy the RDB. And the trigger delivered, and it isn't gassy as f*** when suppressed, and there is a proper adjustable gas block, and there are no CH issues.  Now the RDB has its own issues including spotty QC, but I wouldn't go around comparing the MDR to anything you can actually purchase at this point.


Title: Re: 2018 update
Post by: thehun on January 08, 2018, 03:37:48 PM
Negative. That is not what is being said. That is what you might be perceiving.

Customers have every right to ask whatever questions or concerns they have.

Knowing what parts are or are not imported is actually a valid concern.

Do you know which parts are or are not imported on your Keltec?  Have you ever posted in a forum about it or any other gun besides the MDR?  Sure it's a valid concern, but I suspect it's "more valid" with the MDR since it's a gun you have been crapping on here for the last 6 months.

Have any of your other gun manufacturers posted "machine monday" videos on facebook showing them machining the bulk of the gun parts in house?


I wouldn’t question KelTec on what materials they use because I recognize that at their price points more than likely the materials are likely not top tier.

The problem is that DT keeps having supplier issues all the time that causes delays and then they announce a part is outsourced. So yes. When the company keeps not deliverying on promises...I question so that my hard earned dollars don’t go to waste. If it hurts your feelings...that’s on you.

For what DT charges for these weapons...it is a luxury-top end brand after all...nothing but perfection should be expected both out of the product and the company.

Still some fail to see that I want the MDR to succeed. Some times feedback from consumers that critique things is what ‘s needed.


Title: Re: 2018 update
Post by: Clarke-Sensei on January 08, 2018, 03:49:50 PM
I'm not sure what on earth makes you think DTA is capable of choosing good suppliers foreign or domestic.  They have proven nothing but the opposite for years now.  No real point in speculating because we will never know (they could have made it all up again), but to claim that "you are sure DTA chose good parts" is a bad joke at this point.

Do you know what the biggest difference is between a $800 RDB and a $2500 MDR?  I can actually buy the RDB. And the trigger delivered, and it isn't gassy as f*** when suppressed, and there is a proper adjustable gas block, and there are no CH issues.  Now the RDB has its own issues including spotty QC, but I wouldn't go around comparing the MDR to anything you can actually purchase at this point.

Let me start off with the sheer fact that I'll gladly take an RDB and RFB over an MDR. I love Kel-Tec's designs, and they get things right for a good price. Those reasons alone in comparing the RDB and MDR are reasons why I would rather purchase an RDB over the MDR (I also think the MDR is rather ugly). I don't see any personal advantage for myself to take an MDR over a KT.

I will say in my own defense that DT has a quality expectation that they have to live up to, and repair at this point. That is the simple reason why I'm sure they hired a manufacturer to make a good quality component. Yet, it seems like they got a company just like themselves who hit "snags" along the way. The validity of those snags is questionable, but the parts quality is likely there.


Title: Re: 2018 update
Post by: Ditcher on January 08, 2018, 04:08:12 PM
Is this why DT doesn't want to take care of the Bullpupforum GP?  :)


Title: Re: 2018 update
Post by: Clarke-Sensei on January 08, 2018, 04:14:26 PM
Is this why DT doesn't want to take care of the Bullpupforum GP?  :)

If it is, I'm sure we wouldn't be too surprised. I know I wouldn't be.


Title: Re: 2018 update
Post by: whiskey91lima on January 08, 2018, 04:17:00 PM
Desert Tech does have a reputation of manufacturing high quality, high price tag rifles. I pre-ordered precisely because of my experience with the SRS and DT customer service. To me, the PR nightmare really seems like mistakes made from inexperience developing a radically new product (for them) by a small company.

I will pass my final judgement on the quality of the MDR once I am able to shoot a couple thousand rounds through mine, and it does look like delivery will actually happen in the next few months. However, if they keep delaying month after month into the summer, I will seriously reconsider cancelling my order. Until then, the vitriol on this forum is reaching a crescendo.

Let me start off with the sheer fact that I'll gladly take an RDB and RFB over an MDR. I love Kel-Tec's designs, and they get things right for a good price. Those reasons alone in comparing the RDB and MDR are reasons why I would rather purchase an RDB over the MDR (I also think the MDR is rather ugly).

A digression but I am actually of the opposite opinion. I think that the looks of the MDR are much much better looking than the Keltecs. Though the RDB survival is something else entirely. Granted, looks are almost entirely subjective. That being said, I have no problem with the RFB/RDB rifles and almost bought one myself. The only thing preventing me from buying a RFB is that I don't like >2 MOA accuracy on a .308 rifle.


Title: Re: 2018 update
Post by: Clarke-Sensei on January 08, 2018, 04:27:37 PM
I like the more utilitarian look of the KT's, especially the RFB. The MDR looks like a Mass Effect gun, and while I love Mass Effect, I don't care for the weapon aesthetics (except the Geth Pulse rifle and the Mattock).
Certainly don't blame you on holding off due to the average accuracy of the RFB. I'm not keen on shooting the wings off a fly, so ~2 MOA is fine for my uses should I pick one up.


Title: Re: 2018 update
Post by: thehun on January 08, 2018, 08:57:54 PM
Is this why DT doesn't want to take care of the Bullpupforum GP?  :)

If it is, I'm sure we wouldn't be too surprised. I know I wouldn't be.

If it is...then DT as a company needs a lot of growing up to do...


Title: Re: 2018 update
Post by: Frostburg on January 09, 2018, 01:49:13 PM
I'm not sure what on earth makes you think DTA is capable of choosing good suppliers foreign or domestic.  They have proven nothing but the opposite for years now.  No real point in speculating because we will never know (they could have made it all up again), but to claim that "you are sure DTA chose good parts" is a bad joke at this point.

Do you know what the biggest difference is between a $800 RDB and a $2500 MDR?  I can actually buy the RDB. And the trigger delivered, and it isn't gassy as f*** when suppressed, and there is a proper adjustable gas block, and there are no CH issues.  Now the RDB has its own issues including spotty QC, but I wouldn't go around comparing the MDR to anything you can actually purchase at this point.

I highly recommend the RDB. It's a great rifle! Sure, they have had some QC issues, but they have mostly worked to resolve them. The RDB is a lightweight, well balanced, ergonomically designed rifle that is easy to shoulder, handle and work. It has a highly simplistic design, and breaks down like no other rifle. In terms of design, it's all pros as I can think of no real cons (besides the stiff bolt release and non-numbered gas adjust). It's easily the best handling 5.56 rifle on the planet today.

Let me start off with the sheer fact that I'll gladly take an RDB and RFB over an MDR. I love Kel-Tec's designs, and they get things right for a good price. Those reasons alone in comparing the RDB and MDR are reasons why I would rather purchase an RDB over the MDR (I also think the MDR is rather ugly). I don't see any personal advantage for myself to take an MDR over a KT.

I will say in my own defense that DT has a quality expectation that they have to live up to, and repair at this point. That is the simple reason why I'm sure they hired a manufacturer to make a good quality component. Yet, it seems like they got a company just like themselves who hit "snags" along the way. The validity of those snags is questionable, but the parts quality is likely there.


Title: Re: 2018 update
Post by: spector762 on January 09, 2018, 07:48:26 PM
https://www.facebook.com/deserttechHQ/videos/1755640507800017/?hc_ref=ARRTk_XQ8vqtVJpXhpQWkGMB0ABEHEC_5tyTIM92mRsp2_QNHiqeVJi1HTXiSYzyPO8&fref=nf


Title: Re: 2018 update
Post by: spector762 on January 09, 2018, 07:49:38 PM
chill folks there coming


Title: Re: 2018 update
Post by: Ditcher on January 09, 2018, 08:19:30 PM
Was there ejection chutes in the parts bin?


Title: Re: 2018 update
Post by: whiskey91lima on January 09, 2018, 08:33:43 PM
Was there ejection chutes in the parts bin?

I can taste the salt...


Title: Re: 2018 update
Post by: whiskey91lima on January 10, 2018, 07:12:41 PM
Latest CBM video of the MDR assembly:

https://youtu.be/xgwj3OG3Nag (https://youtu.be/xgwj3OG3Nag)

CBM, is that a 5.56?


Title: Re: 2018 update
Post by: reason on January 10, 2018, 07:46:14 PM
Looks like a 223 to me...


Title: Re: 2018 update
Post by: Ross on January 10, 2018, 07:47:58 PM
Yep it's a 5.56.


Title: Re: 2018 update
Post by: kfeltenberger on January 10, 2018, 08:35:27 PM
Crocket's Theme...cool.


Title: Re: 2018 update
Post by: EWTHeckman on January 10, 2018, 11:45:06 PM
Yep it's a 5.56.

::salty::

If I hadn't had to cancel, that might have been my rifle being assembled.

::salty::  :-[


Title: Re: 2018 update
Post by: Frostburg on January 11, 2018, 02:26:30 AM
Yep it's a 5.56.

Cool! Forget about price! Weight, weight?!?!?!!?!? 


Title: Re: 2018 update
Post by: Blackandwhiteknight on January 11, 2018, 02:47:49 PM
The weight is... the weight of a semi auto .308 rifle... deal with it.


Title: Re: 2018 update
Post by: Clarke-Sensei on January 11, 2018, 03:13:39 PM
Yep it's a 5.56.

Cool! Forget about price! Weight, weight?!?!?!!?!? 

I thought they already said that it'll weigh about the same as the .308 model. Though I suppose all information is suspect.


Title: Re: 2018 update
Post by: Frostburg on January 11, 2018, 06:13:05 PM
Yep it's a 5.56.

Cool! Forget about price! Weight, weight?!?!?!!?!? 

I thought they already said that it'll weigh about the same as the .308 model. Though I suppose all information is suspect.

All information is suspect and constantly changing. I want a final confirmation once they have their "golden master" as people call them.


Title: Re: 2018 update
Post by: rtp on January 11, 2018, 06:22:16 PM
Yep it's a 5.56.

Cool! Forget about price! Weight, weight?!?!?!!?!? 

I thought they already said that it'll weigh about the same as the .308 model. Though I suppose all information is suspect.

All information is suspect and constantly changing. I want a final confirmation once they have their "golden master" as people call them.

We've been through this.  Added weight from magwell adapter, possibly some weight savings on the barrel. 
No magic, no different chassis.


Title: Re: 2018 update
Post by: HBeretta on January 11, 2018, 11:12:55 PM
Latest CBM video of the MDR assembly:

https://youtu.be/xgwj3OG3Nag (https://youtu.be/xgwj3OG3Nag)

CBM, is that a 5.56?

only if they were assembled this fast.  hey someone had to say it.   ;D


Title: Re: 2018 update
Post by: JesseJames38 on January 12, 2018, 07:51:55 PM
This just in   Desert Tech just got there shipment in of the MIM parts.  did a little unboxing video on there facebook page.


Title: Re: 2018 update
Post by: kfeltenberger on January 12, 2018, 07:59:00 PM
This just in   Desert Tech just got there shipment in of the MIM parts.  did a little unboxing video on there facebook page.

They looked like they were "in the white"...I wonder if the finishing will be done in-house? 


Title: Re: 2018 update
Post by: Ditcher on January 12, 2018, 08:25:53 PM
This just in   Desert Tech just got there shipment in of the MIM parts.  did a little unboxing video on there facebook page.

They looked like they were "in the white"...I wonder if the finishing will be done in-house? 

From what I remember from their other post they been doing the finishing in house.


Title: Re: 2018 update
Post by: Sdevante on January 12, 2018, 08:32:32 PM
#CautiouslyOptimistic


Title: Re: 2018 update
Post by: Lead_Whisperer on January 12, 2018, 10:22:48 PM
Let's just hope they are in-spec


Title: Re: 2018 update
Post by: ammomans on January 13, 2018, 08:27:01 AM
Let's just hope they are in-spec

For sure!

I wonder why they took the time to blur out all the shipping labels in the video?  Are they worried we'll find out who made their parts for them? Not being negative, just wondering what they have to hide, especially since apparently lots of manufactures use whatever company they used...


Title: Re: 2018 update
Post by: sampitt on January 13, 2018, 08:38:11 AM
Let's just hope they are in-spec

For sure!

I wonder why they took the time to blur out all the shipping labels in the video?  Are they worried we'll find out who made their parts for them? Not being negative, just wondering what they have to hide, especially since apparently lots of manufactures use whatever company they used...

Made in Pakistan #taliban #illuminaticonfirmed


Title: Re: 2018 update
Post by: kfeltenberger on January 13, 2018, 08:51:12 PM
Let's just hope they are in-spec

For sure!

I wonder why they took the time to blur out all the shipping labels in the video?  Are they worried we'll find out who made their parts for them? Not being negative, just wondering what they have to hide, especially since apparently lots of manufactures use whatever company they used...

I would suspect that any company would do that; why confirm to your competitors who you are sourcing parts from?  Besides, if they didn't, that would just give one more thing for people to point and screech at.


Title: Re: 2018 update
Post by: EODBombtechnician on January 14, 2018, 11:13:10 AM
Let's just hope they are in-spec

For sure!

I wonder why they took the time to blur out all the shipping labels in the video?  Are they worried we'll find out who made their parts for them? Not being negative, just wondering what they have to hide, especially since apparently lots of manufactures use whatever company they used...

I would suspect that any company would do that; why confirm to your competitors who you are sourcing parts from?  Besides, if they didn't, that would just give one more thing for people to point and screech at.

Indeed they would.  "They get parts from THAT company?!!  My Father's Brother's Cousin's former roommate used to work there and he said they use substandard materials and the shift manager liked to drag his testicles across every piece.  I'd rather get an RFB."

I'm still holding faith with DT. I want my, I want my, I want my MDR.


Title: Re: 2018 update
Post by: Aussie E on January 14, 2018, 12:00:05 PM
I'm still holding faith with DT. I want my, I want my, I want my MDR.

MDR pre-order: "Money for nothing and quips for free".

AE


Title: Re: 2018 update
Post by: EODBombtechnician on January 15, 2018, 11:00:45 AM
I'm still holding faith with DT. I want my, I want my, I want my MDR.

MDR pre-order: "Money for nothing and quips for free".

AE
Ha ha good one


Title: Re: 2018 update
Post by: thehun on January 15, 2018, 03:53:33 PM
Am I the only one that caught DT blurring out MIM and other insignias on the other white boxes that were laying around the ejection port video on FB?


Title: Re: 2018 update
Post by: Tubal on January 15, 2018, 05:11:55 PM
Am I the only one that caught DT blurring out MIM and other insignias on the other white boxes that were laying around the ejection port video on FB?

Yes.  You're the only one...