BULLPUP FORUM

Bullpup Rifles (Auto & Semi-Auto Centerfire) => Steyr AUG and clones AUG icon => Topic started by: maleante on December 14, 2016, 09:41:45 PM



Title: Steyr bringing back the standard AUG A3 - are you interested?
Post by: maleante on December 14, 2016, 09:41:45 PM
I like AUG's, all AUG's. I think the M1 is great and probably the best AUG yet, but there's certainly a benefit to the standard A3 receiver.

Give me your thoughts and feedback on what you think regarding a return of the original AUG A3 SA guns.

I'm trying to get Steyr to produce them again and it won't happen with my opinion alone. If you have something to say, anything, please voice it here. Decision makers will be following this thread.

Thanks!

(https://scontent.fbed1-2.fna.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/fr/cp0/e15/q65/522234_10151278608051259_503585540_n.jpg?efg=eyJpIjoidCJ9&oh=7ae2a020c097fc3770de408fb1d06bf6&oe=58F4D9FA)


Title: Re: Steyr bringing back the standard AUG A3 - are you interested?
Post by: Major54 on December 14, 2016, 09:53:17 PM
I bought the M1 for the VLTOR receiver and FN barrel. If I had been able to get an A3 with that, it would have been what I bought. As it is, the M1 is nothing more than an expensive hobby gun for me unless someone makes a longer rail system for it.

All that to say yes, I not only want the A3, I need it for my purposes as a patrol carbine. The M1 is nice but doesn't fill the bill for those needing the rail-estate that the A3 offers.


Title: Re: Steyr bringing back the standard AUG A3 - are you interested?
Post by: 65k10 on December 14, 2016, 10:14:35 PM
This is a tough one. I like my A3 better than my A3M1's because of the A3's much more versatile optic rail. Normally yes would be my answer. Trouble is I already have several A3M1's and am on the waiting list for the STG77, so I don't know if I could justify spending the money on another AUG for a while. I suppose if something like this was a year out I might be down for one since I might have enough fun money by then.


Title: Re: Steyr bringing back the standard AUG A3 - are you interested?
Post by: spyderco monkey on December 14, 2016, 10:19:07 PM
Is there something that just prevents them from making the same rail for the A3 M1 receiver? Seems like a way, way easier option then adding another rifle to the lineup.


Title: Re: Steyr bringing back the standard AUG A3 - are you interested?
Post by: Graccus on December 15, 2016, 12:01:08 AM
Sadly I don't have any experience with the A3, but I love the A3M1. Though other promising bullpups are headed our way, I think the AUG is currently the best. The balance and overall feel is much better than examples like the Tavor, which I think is only more popular due to better marketing and the nostalgia of having an Israeli gun. If Steyr could bring the price point down a little and provide a better stock trigger, then that would help a lot.

I'm worried Steyr is going the way of HK where for some reason they don't seem to want to invest much into the civilian matket. Hopefully that changes since they've always been a fabulous company known for great products and good quality. Hell, maybe they should start by making their own branded AR15, since I know lots of people would buy it simply for the name. Sorry I realize none of that really addresses your topic. I imagine someday I'll try and get my hands on an A3, but currently I'm exploring other options.


Title: Re: Steyr bringing back the standard AUG A3 - are you interested?
Post by: Gear Head on December 15, 2016, 12:14:44 AM
I think instead of doing the M1 receiver, they should have just done an integral scope that fit the A3 receiver for those that did not want the rail.


Title: Re: Steyr bringing back the standard AUG A3 - are you interested?
Post by: ttarp on December 15, 2016, 01:00:24 AM
Quote
I think instead of doing the M1 receiver, they should have just done an integral scope that fit the A3 receiver for those that did not want the rail.

This.


Title: Re: Steyr bringing back the standard AUG A3 - are you interested?
Post by: LazyEngineer on December 15, 2016, 01:02:10 AM
Pick one and standardize.  I thought they did with the M1, and am mildly disturbed to see this topic.  Personally, I love my A3M1.  The integrated optic was a critical purchase decision parameter for me.  And I really love this rifle.

I like the M1.  I like the QD sling attachment system.  I love the integrated (yet changeable) optics system.  I don"t really champion the A3 design.  (this is subjective), I think it looks stupid, vs the integrated optic M1.

As to rail space, the M1 has a long-rail option.  I'm personally more minimalistic when it comes to rails - and the super long A3 rail just looks like a silly overshoot to my eye.  Others disagree, just my opinion.  




Title: Re: Steyr bringing back the standard AUG A3 - are you interested?
Post by: THX1138 on December 15, 2016, 12:45:58 PM
I don't think the A3 needs to be resurrected, we just need the longer AUG CL rail that fits the M1 receiver.



Title: Re: Steyr bringing back the standard AUG A3 - are you interested?
Post by: INV136 on December 15, 2016, 07:35:38 PM
I've had the Steyr Aug A1 and now I have an A3. As for bringing back the A3, I don't understand why it went away to begin with. I'm very satisfied with my A3 and don't feel the need to get any of the other versions. If Steyr was going to do anything, I'd like to see the Swarovski 1.5X optic available in a removable carry handle that can be attached to my A3 top rail (would that make it an A2? As long as it had the Swarovski optic I'd be happy). That would be neat. I loved that A1 optic and the Swarovski optic was outstanding.


Title: Re: Steyr bringing back the standard AUG A3 - are you interested?
Post by: DMays on December 15, 2016, 07:50:34 PM
I don't think the A3 needs to be resurrected, we just need the longer AUG CL rail that fits the M1 receiver.



I would buy that rail for my A3M1 if available if for no other reason than to have it if I needed it.

At this point I doubt I would buy the A3 as I have taken a liking to red dot type sights and I need minimal rail space. I recently purchased an A3M1 with short rail and have mounted a strikefire on it for now. I may eventually go with an aimpoint pro or similar sight. The short rail is enough for that for me but the length is limiting if you want the sight closer to you. I am not LEO\military so BUIS or lack thereof is not a deal breaker for me.


Title: Re: Steyr bringing back the standard AUG A3 - are you interested?
Post by: spyderco monkey on December 15, 2016, 08:38:39 PM
Once again, is there anything different about the M1 receiver / stock that prevents making a long and low rail (clone of the A3 rail)?


Title: Re: Steyr bringing back the standard AUG A3 - are you interested?
Post by: maleante on December 15, 2016, 09:27:00 PM
Once again, is there anything different about the M1 receiver / stock that prevents making a long and low rail (clone of the A3 rail)?

Yes. Everything above that white line.

(http://i557.photobucket.com/albums/ss12/maleantemalandro/m1hump_zps1trkf2id.jpg)


Title: Re: Steyr bringing back the standard AUG A3 - are you interested?
Post by: Major54 on December 15, 2016, 09:40:55 PM
I don't think the A3 needs to be resurrected, we just need the longer AUG CL rail that fits the M1 receiver.



That works too. I love the clean lines aesthetically of the M1 and understand not many are buying these as "working" rifles. Niche market or not, the beurocratic nonsense that requires a working set of iron sights is what it is.

Looks like the CL rail would fill the need for a usable iron sight radius for thos of us mandated to have it. I am highly anxious to see what the aftermarket rail for the M1 that is starting first production this month will bring us but again, the CL rail would fit the need in outstanding fashion.


Title: Re: Steyr bringing back the standard AUG A3 - are you interested?
Post by: spyderco monkey on December 15, 2016, 11:13:48 PM
Once again, is there anything different about the M1 receiver / stock that prevents making a long and low rail (clone of the A3 rail)?

Yes. Everything above that white line.

(http://i557.photobucket.com/albums/ss12/maleantemalandro/m1hump_zps1trkf2id.jpg)

Thank you. So looking at where that stops vs the length of the A3 rail, by my count you only lose 4-5 rail slots by ending it at the white line.

Are 4-5 extra slots worth a new receiver?

By my measurements, if you run the rail from that spot to edge of the ejection port, that's 10" of rail.

While not a ton of sight radius, it's enough to run a set of backup irons + optic.


Title: Re: Steyr bringing back the standard AUG A3 - are you interested?
Post by: maleante on December 16, 2016, 12:16:41 AM
That's exactly what I've said is needed.

Pete is supposed to make a rail, I'm hoping it is just like that.


The A3 is different altogether, still would like another even with a new rail for the M1.


Title: Re: Steyr bringing back the standard AUG A3 - are you interested?
Post by: Major54 on December 16, 2016, 01:16:01 AM
And that's a reason alone I would be down for one. After three forays into the AUG over three decades, I love the A1 for its sheer aesthetics, the M1 for its winning combination of VLTOR receiver and FN barrel (forgive my ignorance if that last combo was available in latter A3's) but the A3 itself has its own allure.

While most agree pleasing lines are subjective, the whole A3 package looks all business in a so called tactical look (no not keyoard commando BS, but the looks that it was built for serious defensive/offensive duty). Kind of like higher end m4 class variants. Some look inspired by bad movies, others by true competition needs and yet others with a utilitarian look that speaks to durability without needless weight or 47 different rail options that simply get in the way of users utilizing them for legitimate duty purposes.

My admitted ignorance of the evolution of the A3 doesn't alter the appearance in that it was a rifle designed to meet the needs of a wide range of duty use. If the A3 doesn't see a renewal, hopefully Pete or some other innovator will provide a product that will allow the M1 to also be in that vein of a rifle ready built to host a lot of different user needed variations.


Title: Steyr bringing back the standard AUG A3 - are you interested?
Post by: RickyRifle on December 16, 2016, 07:42:09 AM
Yes, I would be in for one. I was really soured on the AUG when they went to the M1 receiver. I bought a green A3; when I was ready to purchase a black A3, none were to be found. I was so disappointed, I haven't even looked at any of the new AUG offerings.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Title: Re: Steyr bringing back the standard AUG A3 - are you interested?
Post by: CabbitOne on December 16, 2016, 02:37:03 PM
I like the M1... but I like being able to use aftermarket rails even more.
I don't see everyone jumping on the M1 bandwagon for a VERY long time. That said, I'm only buying A3s. New ones, would be nice.


Title: Re: Steyr bringing back the standard AUG A3 - are you interested?
Post by: photog22740 on December 24, 2016, 12:14:08 PM
I have a A3 original run (Sabre Defense, before they were shut down by ATF), with the compensator vice the tulip flash suppressor, that looks like new and only had maybe 100 rds or so run through it, I have been pondering selling.  It also has the green stock.  Haven't actively listed it, as I hadn't totally made up my mind, but this thread got me thinking about it.  I asked Pete about numbers, and he said he thought only about 3000 were made.


Title: Re: Steyr bringing back the standard AUG A3 - are you interested?
Post by: chickendumpling on December 26, 2016, 02:43:46 PM
Not interested ... M1 over the A3 any day.    A3 was a piece IMHO and poorly designed for the US market.   The aftermarket had to improve the A3 and a lot of vendors did so with $ in their eyes and pointing out the flaws in the A3 design.  As some have said, the aftermarket basically gave us the M1 on the A3  ::)

For myself, glad I sold off the A3 ... but if its your thing, sweet and enjoy.


Title: Re: Steyr bringing back the standard AUG A3 - are you interested?
Post by: scstrain on December 26, 2016, 09:38:46 PM
I like all Aug's but my favorite is the A3.  I was counting the days to get one right after it was announced that they would be available.  It is a Sabre defense and has worked well since day one.  It is plenty enough accurate for me but I wish Steyr would figure out and offer  a new trigger pack with a better pull. I think that is what would make the most people out in the AUG world the happiest !


Title: Re: Steyr bringing back the standard AUG A3 - are you interested?
Post by: justinf on January 02, 2017, 11:17:44 AM
One thing is certain: not many (if any) A3s to be found on the used market.  That says a lot.


Title: Re: Steyr bringing back the standard AUG A3 - are you interested?
Post by: desertmoon on January 11, 2017, 12:14:32 AM
The AUG largest weakness, IMO, is the lack of a good BUIS sight radius.  The A3 allowed for that to be corrected and WELL corrected.

The M1...not so much.  I'd love to see an A3 and would likely sell my M1 to re-fund an A3.


Title: Re: Steyr bringing back the standard AUG A3 - are you interested?
Post by: spyderco monkey on January 11, 2017, 02:58:43 AM
How much backup iron sight radius is really required? I can shoot off hand standing 100 yards with my Five Seven fairly well (7/10 hits on a torso steel) and the front sight is 0.140" wide, and the sight radius is 7" long - and that's without a shoulder stock.

Pete's new long rail for the M1 is what, about 10"? Wouldn't that provide enough sight radius for any realistic application of backup sights (especially given the high reliability of current optics?)

That being said, I think it would be cool, and be an 80/20 solution to everyone's desires, to have a run of 25-100 A3 receivers made by VLTOR, for anyone who wants to use either the Suarez or Corvus long rail designed for the A3.


Title: Re: Steyr bringing back the standard AUG A3 - are you interested?
Post by: 7n6 on January 15, 2017, 03:09:52 PM
I don't think the A3 needs to be resurrected, we just need the longer AUG CL rail that fits the M1 receiver.




I'd go for that rail if we could get one.


Title: Re: Steyr bringing back the standard AUG A3 - are you interested?
Post by: maleante on January 15, 2017, 04:56:45 PM
With the CL rail and the SF optic, I've come to the conclusion that Steyr in Austria does not want to sell it to the US market right now. They claim it's too expensive to produce - I've been told that the SF optic housing would add ~$1000 to the price of an AUG. But whether or not that is accurate I don't know. I'm under the impression that Austria wants to keep certain things out of the US. There's AUG stuff behind the gates in Austria that is like pulling teeth to get information on and/or get it to the USA. You'd think Steyr would want to... I don't know... maybe sell stuff?

I find it interesting that the new Rheinmetall RS556 sports a newly designed detachable SF optic that sits on top of their AR type gun.

If Steyr USA had the capability and expertise, I think a lot of cool things would be available to the AUG consumer. Take Geiselle for example, they have a couple mechanical engineers designing new stuff full-time and their product line is always expanding and surprising their customer base. Steyr is tweaking a 40 year old design - not to say it is bad or outdated, but improvements could be made on the basic design that would put it on par with the other contenders in the bullpup segment.

rant over.


Title: Re: Steyr bringing back the standard AUG A3 - are you interested?
Post by: 7n6 on January 15, 2017, 08:05:56 PM
I'd be happy with that longer rail as an option on the M1. Not a fan of their rails they offer currently with that set up and my M1 is wearing a 3x optic- which I'm glad to own. However it would be nice with a stacked Aimpoint M4s, NV optic, and a PEQ along with a suppressor w/the gas plug adverse setting bored out to .101. Basically, the AUG needs to be a bit more ergonomic and offer the ability to use suppressors, stacked optics etc.


Title: Re: Steyr bringing back the standard AUG A3 - are you interested?
Post by: desertmoon on January 18, 2017, 10:04:27 PM
With the CL rail and the SF optic, I've come to the conclusion that Steyr in Austria does not want to sell it to the US market right now. They claim it's too expensive to produce - I've been told that the SF optic housing would add ~$1000 to the price of an AUG. But whether or not that is accurate I don't know. I'm under the impression that Austria wants to keep certain things out of the US. There's AUG stuff behind the gates in Austria that is like pulling teeth to get information on and/or get it to the USA. You'd think Steyr would want to... I don't know... maybe sell stuff?

I find it interesting that the new Rheinmetall RS556 sports a newly designed detachable SF optic that sits on top of their AR type gun.

If Steyr USA had the capability and expertise, I think a lot of cool things would be available to the AUG consumer. Take Geiselle for example, they have a couple mechanical engineers designing new stuff full-time and their product line is always expanding and surprising their customer base. Steyr is tweaking a 40 year old design - not to say it is bad or outdated, but improvements could be made on the basic design that would put it on par with the other contenders in the bullpup segment.

rant over.

I am not so sure it isn't that Steyr doesn't want to sell guns as much as it's a bit of good ol' German/Austrian snobbery when it comes to their gun designs. 

I LOVE German guns but, working for Germans and having been a fan of many German companies, they do seem to approach Americans with the attitude that what they design is plenty good enough and that Yankee designs are rough and under-designed.  If there is something that we can engineer....THEY can over engineer it better.

I am just surprised that there aren't just a few more really good companies doing some aftermarket stuff for the AUG.  The sticky plastic components of the trigger group deserve a bit of a look.  20/20 has a great product with their 20/20 Precision Sear.  I'd love to see an aluminum TRIGGER, too.  I think that would really round out my main complaint with the AUG, the inconsistent trigger pull.

The A3M1 was an attempt to return the AUG to a bit of its more austere ( pun intended? ) roots but I think that backfired as many of use would like the flexibility of running a rail of our personally designed length on the AUG....the M1 limits that, unfortunately...at least in the forward direction.

That being said....as bullpups go ( and actually do NOT like bullpups as a rule ) the AUG is an amazing gun.  I hope they sell like hotcakes and open up more of an aftermarket.